E-myth Revisited
 

I recently read E-Myth Revisited because so many sowpubbers recommend it. And was very dissappointed!

I thought it was very fluffy - and lacked the nuts and bolts - the details that tell you what to do and how to do it.

(The book was more about what to do and why to do it. Not much how to in it...)

Is there some other book or resource you would recommend for:

* hiring people and outsourcing work
* transitioning from you doing the work to your employee doing the work
* creating operations manuals
* growing and managing the internal structure of your co.

(I don't want to know why you should do all those things. I want to know how to do those things better...)

Would love to hear personal anecdotes too...

Re: E-myth Revisited
 

Hi, Ankesh,

There's a book by Harvey MacKay, of envelope fame, about how he eventually wound up in that particular business. I found it very instructive in the ways in which circumstances and opportunities evolve into businesses. He delves into the how-to of making things happen to open doors and develop a business...and how/when to make course corrections. Now if I could only recall the name of the book! I'm sure if you looked up Harvey MacKay, you'd find it. I'd do it but my computer isn't cooperating totally these days.

Managing a business is all about managing and developing people. Period. The rest of the activities can be farmed out, for the most part, but managing people will be your most critical duty as a business owner/manager. Any skill you can develop to deal with various personalities, teaching and training of various types of learners, and group dynamics will stand you in good stead.

A personal example of people development. I had an assistant who was a whiz on computers and with inventory but couldn't seem to sell the large ticket items. After observing her for several days, I saw the problem. She didn't know the products and how to demonstrate them to the customer. She could recite all the points of the product like you'd find in a brochure but couldn't relate them to the customer.

I planned a time where it'd be just the two of us in the store and put her through some show and tell. She balked and resisted, said she felt silly, but I insisted. Eventually she got to the point where she could do the demo with me playing the part of various customer types and so on.

About a month after all that she came to me and told me how much it had helped her. Later I had her assist others to learn what she'd been taught. Brought the team closer together and increased sales figures by more than double in just a couple of months. It pays to spend time developing your employees.

Lots more I could share but I'd have to write a book. :D

Sandi Bowman

Re: E-myth Revisited
 

Was it... "How to swim with the Sharks without being eaten alive?" by Harvey Mackay?

Re: E-myth Revisited
 

Hey Ankesh,

I agree that the E-myth Revisited lacked the nuts and bolts and all the how-to stuff and was filled with a lot of fluff.

BUT - I also think that better fluff has never been written for the small business guy.

As simple as the concept of systemizing may sound, it's something that a majority of small business owners never think too much about. Lack of systemizing is also the reason most businesses fail IMO.

If it's a concept that you already understand, I would agree that it's something you don't really need to read.

For me, it came at a point where I really needed it and it totally changed my way of thinking. I'd never really considered doing things that way before. It was all a new concept to me and written in a way that it was really easy to follow and understand.

I would go as far as saying that it was life-changing for me because it was something I NEEDED to understand.

I'd say that it was the single-most important book I've ever read and that no other knowledge I've gained and implemented from any other book turned into in results even close.

The other book by Michael Gerber "E-myth Mastery"I wouldn't recommend - it was a tough read and hard to follow. Not any real how-to stuff either.

Their free training really helped me out a lot but might be too basic for what you are looking for.

There's some more advanced stuff at the Emyth website that looks promising but I haven't used any of it so I can't give an honest opinion but might be something to check out.

Jim

Re: E-myth Revisited
 

It well could've been "Swim with the sharks without being eaten alive" because I recall reading that book a long time ago. Thanks for the memory jogger.

Sandi Bowman

Re: E-myth Revisited
 

Although the "E-myth Revisited" fell short on the how to do aspect, for me there was an important nugget of understanding that clarified a misunderstanding about going into business for one's self.

It's the "technition" term I'm referring to.

According to the book, a "technition" is real good at their craft - like a woman who bakes the best blueberry pies ever (or enter any other product that's the "best ever").

Raves about the product are never-ending accompanied by "Wow, this is so good, you should go into this business".

They're good at creating a great product, but have no business skills whatsoever. Many "technitions" who rely solely on the product may fail due to failure to effectively operate the business.

This can also be applied to why MLM's rarely succeed. Just because you know people, doesn't mean they would be good at developing their own income - nor would most want to.

The true entrepreneur knows all that's involved, what needs to be done and is willing to do so. You don't even need to be the creator of the "best product ever" - just market it better than the competiton.

Lawrence

Re: E-myth Revisited
 

You can get all the information from email if you even buy his tapes.

But there is only really four steps for any business

Find a huge market
Find a product and or a service for this huge market
Find a sales system to Reach this market
Find Back up Products and or services for this market.


The hardest for anyone is the sales system. Yes there are many ways to reach a market but it takes money don't think you can do it all for free, you can't

Re: E-myth Revisited
 

Thanks Joe.

But I'm not looking for info on how to grow my biz... but looking for how to structure my biz so that it grows without me.

Re: E-myth Revisited
 

Hey Ankesh.

I think the reason that there's not much written on this is because there's no one-size-fit-s all "system" that can really be written about and duplicated.

Each business is unique and needs to do things in different ways. There are concepts behind developing systems that should probably be written about. I've even attempted to write about it before but even the concepts are difficult to put on paper.

You mentioned something that I think is really important.......

There's a huge difference between building something that 'runs" without you and something that "grows" without you.

Building something that "runs" without you can sometimes be as simple as hiring someone that can do things as good as yourself and walking away.

Growth is a whole other issue and a far more important one.

A few ways I do things......

Out of over a dozen employees now in my cabinet shop, only two of them are paid hourly. That would be the two office gals.

Everyone else's pay is incentive based.

My manager, for example is paid minimum wage as his base salary plus a variety of bonuses including....

bonus on total monthly sales
bonus on total monthly profit
bonus for growth over last month
bonus for growth over last year (for same month)
and a few others

His minimum wage job paid him $165K last year

The guys in the shop are paid on piece work meaning that they are paid a specific amount per job.

They can make as low as $400 per week or as much as $1500 per week depending on how fast they work.

Installers - same thing. They are paid a commission. The faster they get things done, the more they make.

On top of that, both the shop guys and the installers are paid an "on-time" bonus, meaning that when a job is sent to the shop, there is a deadline (usually a week before the scheduled install date) that in must be completed by. Their pay can go up or down depending on when they complete the job. The installer also has a timeframe that the job has to be completed in.

A lot of good things happen when you set something like this up. While they all have schedules, we pretty much let them do as they want. If they need to come in a couple hours late or leave a couple hours early it's never a problem. They know what needs to get done and what they need to make.

They control their own paychecks. (and they all want to make a lot!)

The more they make - the more I make

Our salespeople/designers are all paid on commission. They have a set commission for any jobs they sell that we provide the leads for.

They also have a huge incentive to get their own leads - an extra 2% commission. Doesn't sound like much but when the jobs they sell are usually in the 10-30K range, it really adds up and gives them a reason to grow my business.

I should note that we only deal with contractors so once they've got them signed up, that extra 2% is theirs for as long as they stay with us, even if that contractor calls us directly instead of them.

So, there in a nutshell is my secret to "growth"

Give employees a reason to grow your business, make them want to come into work, and reward them handsomly for it.

Now, with all that said, there is still the issue of systemizing.

None of that stuff can happen without systems running in the background to hold it all together and make the entire process streamlined and efficient for everybody involved.

What kind of business are you trying to build?

If you want to share the details here, it might be fun for everyone here to put our heads together and come up with systems that will work for you.

If not, email me privately and I'll take a crack at it.

Jim

Re: E-myth Revisited
 

Even if you have a shopping Cart on the net you need a system and someone running it. Nothing runs completely by itself. Someone has to write copy product the product etc. You can outsource all this, what you can't do. But you need people for things. You or someone else.

Re: E-myth Revisited
 

Joe, I think you are missing the entire point of systemizing.

Sure, you need people, those people just shouldn't be you.

The book that Ankesh mentioned here, "The E-myth revisited" would be a really good read for you since it doesn't seem like you are even familiar with the concept of systemizing.

Jim

Re: E-myth Revisited
 

You just insulted me Jim I know what a system is. But nothing runs it self. You either outsource or have employees. Even if you use the net with autoresponse and a shopping cart. What do you do what a Customer writes or email you? Nothing operates without people. I have all of the books I think Michael Gerber wrote and one of his audio programs. It is all the same. I know what he is talking about. Someone has to run the business. I once worked for a school. He was the president. No he was not in at times. But he had people running for him. Sales people, teachers, secretary and accounting to name a few. And I have a MBA so please do insult me telling me I don't know something so damn simple. Don't forget empoyees have payroll taxes that you have the match social Security and Medica Care. That has put more business out of business that anything think else.

I have a lawyer client that I do typing and pdf files for. He knows nothing about the computer. So I run this for him amount other people that help him. He once had a Construction Business with his now deceased brother.

He told me why is company went out of business in 1990 after starting in 1989. 1. Under capitalization, 2. employment taxes, and 3. under bidding jobs.

My paper in Graduate school is "Why Small Business Failed" I only found two things. No Marketing knowledge and experience. Others have found 10 things.

Including the 3 my client failed with. Even as a lawyer he only makes about $20,000. He will not listen to me about marketing. You go figure. He like the clients that don't have money to pay a good fee.

Re: E-myth Revisited
 

Joe,

My post was not meant as an insult.

It was very clear from your post and has been made even clearer from your reply that you DO NOT understand what we are talking about here.

Jim

Re: E-myth Revisited
 

Thanks Joe. I don't think Jim is trying to insult anyone here. The whole topic is about how to make the systems and the business work "Without" you. Its ok if other people run it.

In fact,

The ideal thing would be to have a system as well as a meta-system in place (a system that creates systems.) Both run by "other" people.

Re: E-myth Revisited
 

Thanks Jim for willing to help.

I've been juggling 2 very promising new big projects since a few months now. I don't want to give up one of them - although working on both together is delaying them both...

A few disclosures:

1. Am in a good position financially. Can take holidays whenever I want. Lots of flexibility.

2. I have 2 people working for me right now (1 is full time, other is part time).

3. The problem is work keeps on piling up. For eg: I took the day off yesterday. But today - I have a bit more work to do than usual.

What I want is to be like the big public limited companies. Where the "owners" don't work at all.

(All this clicked for me before E-Myth - when I read a comic book on Chanakya last year. Chanakya united whole of India 2500 years ago - without lifting a sword. He got others to lift the sword for him.)

Few things I'm looking for help in is:

1. Hiring some one to read my emails. I usually spend 1-2 hours everyday - when I work - on emails. How do you outsource emails when all of the emails are not related to any specific project? Its a scary thought - training someone and teaching them how to answer questions for 6 different projects. At the same time, its not a job I can outsource to more than one person...

2. Hiring a project manager. Right now, I over look the day to day work. And supervise 2 people working for me. But would like someone else to take this over. The problem is transitioning - how do you hire a CEO without giving away a lot of control - when your company is so small?

Re: E-myth Revisited... Your Answer & Solution!
 

Ankesh,

Here's your Solution! :)

Sounds like you need more of a Virtual Assistant(s) to Help with those details. :)

As you know Googling will give you a Great selection...

A Worldwide choice and Affordability, especially if you Think about your preference of Location and the Currency within your Budget. ;)

A few Resources to consider...

A Business Opportunity &/or Virtual Assistant Resource...
http://www.entrepreneur.com/starting...icle71516.html

http://www.vanetworking.com/
http://www.google.com/Top/Business/B...al_Assistants/

Phil

Why SOB's Succeed & Nice Guys/Gals Fail in Biz
 

Dear Ankesh,

Thanks for the question.

One of my favorite books of "Grow the biz with Systems"

is Bob Morrisons book.

"Why SOB's Succeed and Nice Guys/Gals Fail in Business"

I used to buy cases of books from bob at 10.00 a book. Resell box after box of his books to small business owners for 25.00 to 30.00 each.

Bob has a system for borrowing money from greedy bankers.
When you have no moolah.

Bob has a system for negotiating with new sales employees. So they talk themselves into working on a %age - instead of a salary.

Bob has bought or built scores of small businesses.

So his book is full of Case Studies, anecdotes and even some clever drawings to illustrate key points.

Glenn

Re: E-myth Revisited
 

I explained I know systems with clients and reading all those books. No you don't have to do all work or any of it. You can have employees or outsource.

Here is how I outsources one of my public domain books. I found out I have to have pages not the book for a company to make a pdf for $20 for me to put in my shopping cart. I had my printer company them for $10 and make the book pages gave them to the company to make a pdf file for me the sell that book. I have to travel around the city. I could have hired someone to do that to I guess. But I don't want a payroll. I do payroll for clients and they hate payroll but need like bars and things that must have them.

Re: Why SOB's Succeed & Nice Guys/Gals Fail in Biz
 

Thanks Glenn.

I've read one of Bob Morrison's book before. His son was selling them on ebay...

I'll try finding "Why SOB's Succeed and Nice Guys/Gals Fail in Business"

Thanks.

Re: E-myth Revisited
 

Ankesh.

I think you have the idea for success and I wish you well. You have a great system. Michael Gerber does say to put all the things people do and how they do in writing. See I read the book.

Like I said I outsource at times. My son is doing something on ebay for me right now. I outsource to him for part of a profit if any. I don't have time I have a big tax load for my January to April big job project. I do have an associate that efiles for me. We bartered and no money usually changes hands. One time he did give me $500 because he had a great year.

Re: E-myth Revisited
 

You just sold me I went to Amazon.com and bought the Bob Morrison book, it was a steal, Postage and everything just about $8.00. Can't beat that. Can't wait to read it. Thanks, Friends.

Re: E-myth Revisited
 

Yeah, I kinda know the feeling.


Where are all the emails coming from? Are a majority of them from a specific website of yours? Are a lot of the questions the same? If so, there are a lot of programs out there for support ticketing systems.

I'm sure you've seen them. Users can select from a list of topics and ask their question about that topic. They are then sent an auto reply answering questions about that topic and asked "did this answer your question?"

If yes - the ticket is closed.

If no - the ticket is routed to whoever you specify for that topic.

If your emails are coming in from a variety of sources, it would obviously be much more difficult and I don't see an obvious solution.


Why do you want the control? Control causes headaches. I used to think I needed to control everything. Now I think totally opposite. I try to give that control away to people smarter than me (not hard to find) whenever I can.

I use Basecamp to check in on things whenever I want to and I can see what's going on with all of my stuff on one screen, any time.

I know you've seen Basecamp, but probably only very few things that it can do. It's the best online project manager in existance....

http://www.basecamphq.com/

I've got three businesses that run on one Basecamp account.

You can assign different people or companies to different projects and give people different levels of access.

For example - each business only sees their own stuff and is not able to see what the others are doing.

All the updates and project statuses are posted there for me to see.

My lawyer and accountant have access to all projects, but only to contact whoever they need to. People that don't need to see that stuff don't have access to it.

If we set up with a new vendor, I can add that vendor to the project so they can communicate with whoever they need to but not have access to things they don't need to see.

It's really cool and a great way to keep all communications in one place and sorted in a logical and easy to follow way.

Jim

Re: E-myth Revisited
 

Ankesh, you mention about things backing up and having more to do if you take a day off. That tells me that you may need to backtrack a bit and do a flow sheet analysis to find and eliminate the bottlenecks. It probably doesn't have to be ultra sophisticated since you do have a system, of sorts, in place, but you do need to take note of WHAT needs to be done, in what order, and by whom.

If things are bottlenecking then one of several things are true:

1. One person or portion of the system has too much to handle or is not up to the task so it needs to be looked at and possibly broken down a bit. Also consider some additional training as appropriate.

2. The tasks are not clearly defined so people doing them do not know exactly where their priority tasks are coming from and when, and how to handle them and then hand them off to the right person/department when completed.

3. If you are the source of the bottleneck (which I suspect in one instance at least since you have extra to do when you return after a day off) then you need to get busy and train someone else to do what you'd ordinarily do so you don't have to double time things to take a day off.

No matter what the problem, if things are bottlenecking, a flow chart will help you sort out the problem. If you see a place with 5 source inputs and only 1 output, you have a potential bottleneck in most cases.

A small example: if a machine can cap l bottle per round and the bottles are coming in 3 per round, there's an obvious imbalance there and changes need to be made. Same thing with people and tasks.

Hope this is some help.

Sandi Bowman

Re: E-myth Revisited
 

Sandi Knows what he is talking about, Flow charts were use by Joseph E. Cossman to expain lot of his course. They work for bottlenecks and other things.

You should have detaiil plans for all the jobs that people do in binders. This is in EMyth the book that some think I did not read. Every one in business should read it once or twice a year or even every month. He even wrote a book about contracts and doctors. Did you even go to a doctor and have to wait and wait. Yes I know you have. He had a great plan for them. But how many doctors would do it? They are part of the emyth problem.