Outsourcing... Any experiences?
 

Outsourcing can be a great way to "leverage" your time and business...

I've outsourced various things... I've hired writers, editors, transcriptionists, and graphics people over the years.

What have you outsourced, and what was your experience like? Any tips you'd care to share?

Thanks...!

Best wishes,

Dien

Re: Outsourcing... Any experiences?
 

Well a few years ago I outsourced a website embedded with my Amazon affiliate code for DSL cameras. Fairly nice site, but it didn't make a single penny.

More recently, I outsourced the design of a logo for my LLC. I was pleased, at the time, but I now know after being exposed to higher end graphic design styles that it is only mediocre level design quality. So I will get it redone by a more skilled designer next go round. Live and learn.

Interesting you bring this question up at this time because I am just starting to build an online service that will rely heavily on outsourcing. The good part is skilled and dependable outsource workers have already been identified and all I have to do is drum up the customers. If things progresses as I expect them to, I will scale the service enough to absorb the investment of hiring a project manager who will manage the day to day operations and I will manage he or she. I give this twenty months to build up to the project manager level. Maybe sooner if I snag more recurring business clients than I anticipate getting the first twenty months.

Re: Outsourcing... Any experiences?
 

Hi Spyglass,

I agree, that's the way to do it!

In one of the projects I'm involved with, we're planning to do that too... We're setting everything up, but the plan is, hopefully later this year, we'll hire a manager to manage it all once it's "chugging along" smoothly...!

I know a guy who started a SEO (Search Engine Optimization) business, well over 10 years ago... He set it all up as a "virtual" business, in the sense that there was no office for people to go to, everybody worked from home. He hired at least one sales person (I think he got paid salary + commission), an admin/customer relations person, and an SEO person, who did all the SEO stuff. My friend, the founder, mainly wrote the sales copy for the website, as well as setting it all up. Everybody lived in a different city (though in his business, all lived in the USA or Canada). I think it was (and is) quite a profitable operation...

The HB-type of "virtual organization" outsources too, but in a different way. He partners. So, for example, if he wants a product manufactured, he partners with a company who can do the manufacturing. The manufacturer then sends the products, as needed, in bulk directly to the customers (who, in his case, are big chain stores like Ace Hardware and Home Depot). He just sets it up and oversees it, he never touches the product.

In his case, his "toll positions" protect him from being ripped off. (The manufacturers can't manufacture their own version of his product, since they would be violating his patent protection, for example. Without "toll position" protections, they might just manufacture their own version of the product, and go into competition against him... and it would all be legal.)

Thanks for sharing Spyglass... Very illuminating, and great discussion! :)

Best wishes,

Dien

Re: Outsourcing... Any experiences?
 

I've outsourced tons of stuff from web research to web design and cold calling to small businesses... and the results are almost always directly proportional to the amount of instruction you give and the guidelines that come with the project.

The old hiring/firing line use to be "Hire slow/fire fast" but in the outsourcing world is "Hire fast/fire faster". You simply can't research candidates to death.

Re: Outsourcing... Any experiences?
 

Hi Michael,

This is something I'm only starting to learn... Giving good instructions and guidelines!

I've hired several writers in the past. My policy was to hire a number of them, then keep hiring the ones who did a good job to my liking...

However, I think hiring writers is relatively easy. I've been thinking for a while of hiring some kind of "virtual assistant" type of person... However, to do it right, I think I should take into account the kind of training I might have to give this person, so they will be able to do all the things I'd like them to do. (In my case, it might involve some customer relations work, sending out email broadcasts, some calendar organization, some research work, possibly liaising with other freelancers to ensure other things get done...)

Yes, the strategy I use at the moment, where it's feasible, is to hire multiple people to do a similar job (e.g. write an article, create a graphic, etc.). Then, I keep using the best ones for future work, and don't re-hire the ones who weren't quite as good...

Thanks for sharing that great advice! :)

Best wishes!

Dien

Where to hire? Any recommendations?
 

Does anyone have a good list of places to find outsourced help.

Of course, fiverr.com would be one but what about for a Virtual Assistant? or programmer?

Just a very brief search turned up:

http://www.easyoutsource.com (owned by OnlineJobs.ph)
http://www.onlinejobs.ph/

Thanks,
Rob Yaggie

Re: Where to hire? Any recommendations?
 

Hi Rob,

I've used oDesk before, which has recently changed its name to Upwork, after oDesk merged with Elance...

https://www.upwork.com

I've hired writers and editors there. One of my brothers has hired programmers there for his projects.

Although I've never (yet) hired a virtual assistant, I have on occasion looked through potential virtual assistants to hire on oDesk - now Upwork...

I've hired graphics people through Fiverr https://www.fiverr.com before. I've hired a transcriptionist through Fiverr too, as well as (prior to that) through a couple of specific online transcriptionist companies...

I've generally found them all to be good experiences. As I wrote earlier, my "strategy" is to hire multiple people initially (and give them similar tasks), then choose the best and continue to hire those people for ongoing work...

I hope that helps!

Best wishes,

Dien

Re: Outsourcing... Any experiences?
 

Not used a VA, sorry.

I've used iWriter for articles - be very specific about what you want. The basic level writers usually need a bit of editing but their quality seems to improve as the article gets longer (because they only get paid if you approve).

Transcription: Fiverr. A couple of years back it cost me $5 per 15 minutes.

Some graphics: Fiverr but it can be hit & miss so I also use Freelancer. Again, be specific. For instance I'll spell out that 3 different designs doesn't mean the same design in 3 different colours. I've had most success on graphics on Freelander with Eastern Europeans.

Simple bug fixes on websites: Fiverr. Including fixing scripts, scary htaccess stuff and more.

Programming can be hit and miss on Freelancer and you have to know what you're talking about otherwise they can try to pull the wool over your eyes. Same goes for website design.

I had a database tuned up on Freelancer and the guy was really good (a Russian living in New Zealand).

PeoplePerHour I've recently had some success with on a website redesign. As with Freelancer, take the time to read the reviews (not just the star ratings) and talk with two or three that you shortlist before awarding the project.

Re: Outsourcing... Any experiences?
 

Thanks Trevor,

That's great advice!

While I haven't hired programmers myself (yet), one of my brothers has... I know he had "hit and miss" experiences too.

In his experience, he found some of the programmers he hired from Eastern Europe wrote what they call "spaghetti code"... Which means it works, but it's a nightmare for another programmer to come in later to try to fix it, because it's a nightmare trying to figure out what's going on!

On the other hand, for another project he hired a (much more expensive) American programmer, and the code was well-commented, well-structured, etc. You might not notice the difference at first, but if someone has to go in later to modify it or fix it, that's when you'll notice the difference!

Fantastic advice... I'm going to have to "jump in" further and do a lot more outsourcing (since it also expands what you're capable of as an entrepreneur)...!

Best wishes,

Dien

"Men are cheaper than guns"...
 

Hi,

This chapter/article is about hiring employees, but it applies to outsourcing too...

"Men are cheaper than guns"...

The gist of it is, it's often "cheaper" to hire someone to do something, rather than to try to learn how to do it yourself. It's not only cheaper, but they'll often do a better job, too...

He uses an example from the Yul Brynner movie "The Magnificent Seven" (along with his own experiences)...

"Men Are Cheaper Than Guns"
http://www.hcmpublishing.com/Chapter3excerpt.html

(It's chapter 3 of the book, "Thinking Like an Entrepreneur" by Peter I. Hupalo. I believe Peter Hupalo made his money in the software industry.)

Best wishes,

Dien

Re: Outsourcing... Any experiences?
 

Thanks Dien!

On iWriter my instructions are usually a variant of these:

Please don't write in the third person ("one" etc.)

Please make the style several bullet points/tips (5 or 7 works well).

Please make sure your work is split into paragraphs, not just one long article.

Please don't over-do the keyword density - just write naturally.

Writing is relatively straightforward and is probably the easiest thing to outsource.

Graphics you need to check it's not infringing copyright - not always easy but Google's image search has helped. Or one project the designer sourced the images & I bought them from the recommended stock site.

Coding can be anything from a simple fix to a really big project.

Spaghetti code is always a problem - difficult to specifiy as most programmers have their own style.

Bug testing is the part I really hate as you can't assume that whatever got corrected last time has stayed corrected or something else hasn't got broken in the next iteration.

Microsoft don't get all the bugs fixed and they've got stricter procedures and bigger budgets.

There are so many variables to test and check for.

Even Google "broke" the internet a while back when something they hadn't trapped for happened.

Testing takes longer than you ever plan!

Thanks Dien and Trevor... and nice chapter.. TTS
 

I appreciate the input both of you gave on places to outsource. I'm a programmer by trade so I can agree on the challenges on outsourcing programming tasks. Two programs can technically accomplish the job but can be night and day apart in terms of quality.

Anyway, Dien I enjoyed the chapter 3 that you presented. And on a side note, I just discovered text to speech voices have come a long way. Last week I purchased Textaloud 3 and the premium voice Ava from nextup.com. Very impressive! Not only did it make reading that chapter easier on my aging eyes but I will likely incorporate it as the voice over in some upcoming videos.

Thanks,
Rob Yaggie

P.S. Demo for voices...
http://www.nuance.com/for-business/t...index.htm#demo

I like American English ... Female Ava, Male Nathan. Note, Nathan is not available yet for use on Textaloud but I hope it will be in the future.

P.P.S. - I also used Textaloud to proofread this post :)

Re: Outsourcing... Any experiences?
 

Thanks Trevor for these tips... Excellent ones!

Also, a great list of "do's" and "don'ts" for writers, too...

On graphics, that's good advice. I haven't actually checked to make sure that the graphics I've had made up weren't "stolen" from a copyrighted source. I'll make sure to find out the source in future (to make sure it's legal)! You don't want to have legal headaches down the track!

I know from my brother's experiences that hiring programmers can sometimes be difficult. I think his experience was more or less that you get what you pay for - and he did find that the more expensive programmers were better "quality" - they wrote better code, which was easier to modify or fix up later...

The thing which I didn't realize for a long time is that, hiring is a skill. I naively thought, if you want something done, you just hire someone, and it gets done! Of course, it's rarely that straightforward... However, the more you do, the better at it you get!

Best wishes, :)

Dien

Re: Thanks Dien and Trevor... and nice chapter.. TTS
 

Hi Rob,

That's interesting!

For a while, I was doing some "academic editing" work on the side... I partly kept doing it because I kept learning things, and I'd get the occasionally interesting paper... I'm a "sucker" for interesting stuff... :)

Anyway, I found that sometimes using "text-to-speech" helped with the editing process. I could sometimes catch errors by "listening" to them! (It was especially useful if I got tired of reading...)

On Ch. 3 of "Thinking Like an Entrepreneur" - Peter Hupalo makes a good point, I think...

One point is you'll never be great at everything! You might be great at a couple things, good at a couple others, yet suck at other things. For example, maybe you are great at creating websites, but you really suck at selling your services.

The point is, you could then focus on what you're great at, and hire or partner with one or more people to do what you suck at. So, in this case, you could make websites, and partner with someone, or hire someone, to sell your services for you...

The more complex the business gets, the more this is true...!

A friend of mine started a website building and branding company. He's a great graphic designer, so he focuses on that side of things (I think he does most of the "selling" too). Another partner does all the "coding" stuff related to the websites. And a third partner focuses on the financial side of the business. And in their case... their separation of responsibilities works very well, and they're quite successful!

Best wishes,

Dien

Re: Outsourcing... Any experiences?
 

The advantage of reducing operating costs! It appears because of the difference in wages between countries or just cutting employee compensation costs and office space expenses (and it’s still significant savings). You can save up to 60% of your budget by outsourcing some tasks to another company, so it's definitely the right choice for a business.

We prefer you pay for ads here, is that OK?
 

Dien may accept paid ads, ask him. But until then, we prefer participation, which is why I deleted your signature link.

Gordon