Don't create or modify your web site until you have read this list !
 

A great article, a MUST read if you have a web site or if you're planning one !

This is a list of things you can do to REDUCE your web site traffic (we all know what a headache too much traffic is!).

I would add to their list -- have light purple text on a dark green background!

- Dien


Ways to Reduce Web Site Traffic - from DMNews

Actually, I disagree with at least one thing they say.... What do you think?
 

I disagree with at least one thing in the list of Ways To Reduce Web Site Traffic (linked to below).... That is, I think one of the things they list is often quite GOOD to do.

What do you think? Do you agree with me, or do you agree with all they say?

- Dien


Ways To Reduce Web Site Traffic

Re: Actually, I disagree with at least one thing they say.... What do you think?
 

Dien -

> I disagree with at least one thing in the
> list of Ways To Reduce Web Site Traffic
> (linked to below).... That is, I think one
> of the things they list is often quite GOOD
> to do.

> What do you think? Do you agree with me, or
> do you agree with all they say?

I read this article in hard copy just the other day. I always enjoy reading Dean Rieck's articles. I've known about Dean since my days in the marketing forum on Compuserve.

I'd be interested to know what you disagreed with in the article. I could see a couple of points where either side could be taken.

Rick Smith, "The Net Guerrilla"


Great Posts About Gary Halbert's New Web Site

Long copy vs. short copy on the web....
 

Hi Rick,

> I'd be interested to know what you disagreed
> with in the article. I could see a couple of
> points where either side could be taken.

I was thinking about the one on long copy, even long copy on a single page....

When I read that, what popped into my mind specifically was Marlon Sanders' web site, www.amazingformula.com -- an example of long copy on a single page which appears to be successful.

As long as what you're saying is interesting enough to your target audience so that people keep reading!

What do you think?

- Dien

Write A Novel...But Make It Riveting!
 

Hi Dien & Rick,

I certainly share the opinion of Marlon and many other top copywriters & marketers that long copy is the way to go. In fact, this is far more than an "opinion," as it has been extensively tested.

But when asked WHY long copy is the way to go, I find that many people are at a loss and simply say that "it works better."

So allow me to present one possible way to arrive at this conclusion:

First, I would suggest doing something radically different than most -- run your numbers BEFORE you write your sales letter or build your web site.

In other words, take your price point of your product or service, your profit margin, and your projected cost per visitor. And ask yourself what visitor to sale closing percentage you'd be happy with.

Let's say for argument's sake that you conclude that you'd be happy if 2 out of every 100 unique visitors to your site buy your product or service.

Given this ratio, let me ask you a very important question:

Who do you want to "speak to" with your sales copy -- the 98% of people who WON'T buy, or the 2% of people who WILL buy?

Clearly, the buyers are who you want to reach with your message.

Let's take this a step further.

Naturally, we know that your 2% are VERY interested in your product or service. Otherwise, they wouldn't have bought!

And I don't know about you, but if I'm very interested in a topic, there's no limit to how much I'll read about it -- as long as it's interesting! But this is a BIG "if." If the message is NOT riveting, then even your 2% might lose interest. Don't ever lose sight of the inherent obstacle you face in getting a complete stranger to pull out their wallet while at your web site and give you money.

So let's take a leap of faith and assume that you have riveting, hard-hitting copy. If this is the case, wouldn't you want to anticipate every possible objection your visitors may have, and overcome them in an interesting and compelling manner? And I don't need to tell you the power of telling a story...using industry statistics to support your case...sharing testimonials and reviews to boost your credibility...having a better than risk free guarantee...and countless other elements that go into a successful sales letter.

I think where some marketers go astray is in thinking that if they write shorter, or "teaser" copy, without presenting their whole case, they'll appeal to a wider range of people. And they mistakenly project that they'll close greater than 2% this way, when in fact, the 98% were arguably lost causes to begin with, and the 2% would respond much more favorably to a compelling sales letter!

I do hope that my musings have helped guide those of you who are pondering what form to use with your sales copy :)

All the best,

-Jesse

> Hi Rick,

> I was thinking about the one on long copy,
> even long copy on a single page....

> When I read that, what popped into my mind
> specifically was Marlon Sanders' web site,
> www.amazingformula.com -- an example of
> long copy on a single page which appears to
> be successful.

> As long as what you're saying is interesting
> enough to your target audience so that
> people keep reading!

> What do you think?

> - Dien




Read The Sales Letter That Has Closed $2-3,000 Sales With No Human Contact!

Re: Long copy vs. short copy on the web....
 

> Hi Rick,

> I was thinking about the one on long copy,
> even long copy on a single page....

> When I read that, what popped into my mind
> specifically was Marlon Sanders' web site,
> www.amazingformula.com -- an example of
> long copy on a single page which appears to
> be successful.

> As long as what you're saying is interesting
> enough to your target audience so that
> people keep reading!

> What do you think?

> - Dien

Dien,

Many "gurus" say the long letter works better, especially off-line. Net marketing gurus seem to be leaning toward one or two page websites if you are trying to sell something...of course, that "one" page can be a mile long, too.

If you can keep pulling your reader deeper into your sales message as you go along, more can be better. But if you start to bore your reader, he may click away before he gets to the buy button. To avoid that, you can insert several "buy" opportunities throughout the text giving your reader a chance to "buy now" before he thinks of bailing out early.

The one-page proponents say concentrate on just one product or service and go for the jugular...sell, sell, sell. All of the free content is for your portal page with links to individual mini-sites where you sell your products. Quick introduction, quick sell, quick close, and instant delivery.

Instant gratification...microwave lifestyle. Life in the fast lane...don't you love it!

JDB


Killer Mini-Sites

Re: Write A Novel...But Make It Riveting!
 

This is a very interesting thread, I am learning a lot and I thank everyone for that... I understand the point about longer copy, but I am curious how well longer copy translates to sale marketing via e-mail (that is on a computer screen)... It seems that most people tend to skim things on a computer screen, if that's the case, wouldn't it make sense to entertain the idea of shorter copy? Again, I have no idea (and certainly don't claim to be a master)... Just curious is all... Josh :-)

> Hi Dien & Rick,

> I certainly share the opinion of Marlon and
> many other top copywriters & marketers
> that long copy is the way to go. In fact,
> this is far more than an
> "opinion," as it has been
> extensively tested.

> But when asked WHY long copy is the way to
> go, I find that many people are at a loss
> and simply say that "it works
> better."

> So allow me to present one possible way to
> arrive at this conclusion:

> First, I would suggest doing something
> radically different than most -- run your
> numbers BEFORE you write your sales letter
> or build your web site.

> In other words, take your price point of
> your product or service, your profit margin,
> and your projected cost per visitor. And ask
> yourself what visitor to sale closing
> percentage you'd be happy with.

> Let's say for argument's sake that you
> conclude that you'd be happy if 2 out of
> every 100 unique visitors to your site buy
> your product or service.

> Given this ratio, let me ask you a very
> important question:

> Who do you want to "speak to" with
> your sales copy -- the 98% of people who
> WON'T buy, or the 2% of people who WILL buy?

> Clearly, the buyers are who you want to
> reach with your message.

> Let's take this a step further.

> Naturally, we know that your 2% are VERY
> interested in your product or service.
> Otherwise, they wouldn't have bought!

> And I don't know about you, but if I'm very
> interested in a topic, there's no limit to
> how much I'll read about it -- as long as
> it's interesting! But this is a BIG
> "if." If the message is NOT
> riveting, then even your 2% might lose
> interest. Don't ever lose sight of the
> inherent obstacle you face in getting a
> complete stranger to pull out their wallet
> while at your web site and give you money.

> So let's take a leap of faith and assume
> that you have riveting, hard-hitting copy.
> If this is the case, wouldn't you want to
> anticipate every possible objection your
> visitors may have, and overcome them in an
> interesting and compelling manner? And I
> don't need to tell you the power of telling
> a story...using industry statistics to
> support your case...sharing testimonials and
> reviews to boost your credibility...having a
> better than risk free guarantee...and
> countless other elements that go into a
> successful sales letter.

> I think where some marketers go astray is in
> thinking that if they write shorter, or
> "teaser" copy, without presenting
> their whole case, they'll appeal to a wider
> range of people. And they mistakenly project
> that they'll close greater than 2% this way,
> when in fact, the 98% were arguably lost
> causes to begin with, and the 2% would
> respond much more favorably to a compelling
> sales letter!

> I do hope that my musings have helped guide
> those of you who are pondering what form to
> use with your sales copy :)

> All the best,

> -Jesse




"The Ultimate Marketers Resource Gives You All The Tools And Strategies You Need To Succeed"

The Looooong and the Shrt of Copy
 

There is no Long Copy or Short Copy. There is just Copy. Its length is subjective and comparative.

A one page flyer has long copy when compared to a five line display-classified. A four page letter is long compared to a one pager. And a thirty page letter is long compared to a 20 page letter.

All that matters is, is you copy doing what it was designed to do, for the market it was designed for.

I think it was Gordon who wrote about the inexperienced plumber (inexperienced in marketing) who wrote a real simple ad which said "We do plumbing. Ph 5555-5555".

Quite frankly, the majority of longer copy bores me, for the most part. The reason is, the writer tries to write a piece that sells to everyone. Instead of writing a piece to sell to a more targetted audience.

If I have a headache I don't care about the manufacturing process used to make the headache pill, who invented it, or any "story". All that matters to me at that moment in time is

Do you sell headache pills???

Tell me quick and tell me true, or else my love, to hell with you.

The only long copy that doesn't bore me tells me something I didn't know (educates me) about the subject I'm interested in.

If you've got Ben's 7 Steps read the long Hikuta letter. It's effective, to me, for several reasons...

1: I am interested in martial arts. (if I wasn't I wouldn't read past the first paragraph)

2: It just tells me about the events that transpired with Doc's "show". And THAT allows me to SELL MYSELF.

Psychologically it's a third party telling me about it and not Doc. So I'll believe it more.

There's a Karate letter which starts off telling the reader the writer didn't take up Karate for spiritual awareness etc. He took it up because he was in to WANTON SLAUGHTER. He wanted to be able to obliterate any and all drongos who had problems with him at any time he might be out on the town.

Whatever. The point is, the length of the copy depends on how much you know about your target market and what they're looking for.

I won't even read two paragraphs telling me how to look after my dredlocks cause I don't have any and I have Zero Interest in that subject.

There's a whole lot more that can be said about copy - long and short - but in the end none of it matters. Just sit down, say what you've got to say and be done with it. See if it gets the results you want. Adjust and continue.

Michael Ross.

Perhaps, the way to think of it is ...
 

... not in terms of length, but in terms of how well the copy answers the potential questions of the reader.

For some products or services, the reader may not have many questions and so a short, to-the-point ad will work fine (such as "we do plumbing").

But for products where the reader will have many questions, the copy will have to be longer to answer them adequately. The Hikuta letter is a good example -- if someone is interested enough to read it, he or she will likely want to know "what's this all about?", "who invented it?", "does it really work?", "can you prove it?", "why haven't I heard of this before?", "what makes this different from ____ (karate, kung fu, etc.)?", "where can I get it?", "why should I buy it from you?", "why should I buy it now?", and on and on.

If you judge copy by the questions it answers (or creates, if you want to arouse curiosity), I venture that you'll be less likely to run the risk of having a lot of copy that misses the mark. (There's truth in the adage: "it can't be too long, but it can be too boring.")

Just my $.02

-Phil

> There is no Long Copy or Short Copy. There
> is just Copy. Its length is subjective and
> comparative.

> A one page flyer has long copy when compared
> to a five line display-classified. A four
> page letter is long compared to a one pager.
> And a thirty page letter is long compared to
> a 20 page letter.

> All that matters is, is you copy doing what
> it was designed to do, for the market it was
> designed for.

> I think it was Gordon who wrote about the
> inexperienced plumber (inexperienced in
> marketing) who wrote a real simple ad which
> said "We do plumbing. Ph
> 5555-5555".

> Quite frankly, the majority of longer copy
> bores me, for the most part. The reason is,
> the writer tries to write a piece that sells
> to everyone. Instead of writing a piece to
> sell to a more targetted audience.

> If I have a headache I don't care about the
> manufacturing process used to make the
> headache pill, who invented it, or any
> "story". All that matters to me at
> that moment in time is

> Do you sell headache pills???

> Tell me quick and tell me true, or else my
> love, to hell with you.

> The only long copy that doesn't bore me
> tells me something I didn't know (educates
> me) about the subject I'm interested in. If
> you've got Ben's 7 Steps read the long
> Hikuta letter. It's effective, to me, for
> several reasons...

> 1: I am interested in martial arts. (if I
> wasn't I wouldn't read past the first
> paragraph)

> 2: It just tells me about the events that
> transpired with Doc's "show". And
> THAT allows me to SELL MYSELF.

> Psychologically it's a third party telling
> me about it and not Doc. So I'll believe it
> more.

> There's a Karate letter which starts off
> telling the reader the writer didn't take up
> Karate for spiritual awareness etc. He took
> it up because he was in to WANTON SLAUGHTER.
> He wanted to be able to obliterate any and
> all drongos who had problems with him at any
> time he might be out on the town.

> Whatever. The point is, the length of the
> copy depends on how much you know about your
> target market and what they're looking for.

> I won't even read two paragraphs telling me
> how to look after my dredlocks cause I don't
> have any and I have Zero Interest in that
> subject.

> There's a whole lot more that can be said
> about copy - long and short - but in the end
> none of it matters. Just sit down, say what
> you've got to say and be done with it. See
> if it gets the results you want. Adjust and
> continue.

> Michael Ross.

(g) I'll step in with a controversial point
 

> I was thinking about the one on long copy,
> even long copy on a single page....

This is, btw, what the big research firms have been saying for about 3 years (I have the magazines that talk about this) -- break up copy because people read the web differently than they read print. If you look at major news sites and compare print and web editions, you'll notice that the text is broken up differently and often a bit shorter or spread between pages.

> When I read that, what popped into my mind
> specifically was Marlon Sanders' web site,
> www.amazingformula.com -- an example of
> long copy on a single page which appears to
> be successful.

Here's where I'm going to be controversial -- that page ONLY works on a select audience. It works on the people who have been "trained" that this is is a wonderful and proper presentation.

Don't know if you remember it, but months ago on Lesley's board, someone asked for a review of a site to help increase sales and traffic. It was a long (6-10 screens full) sales letter ALA Marlon Sanders. The marketing experts on the board loved it and said to tweak only a few things. I said it was WAY too long and visually uninteresting and needed to be several pages with the main points up front -- and coworkers in this designer's office (who had no contact with the Business Gurus and their marketing material) echoed my comments.

So -- if you're selling to the market that has been trained to expect this, short will be suspicious and long and filled with examples will be boring. If you're selling to others (like my grown children or my husband or a lot of other people), they expect ads to be short and sweet and want the material spread over pages and condensed and value (instead of long teasers) given. (and they want to know page counts on books, too.)

So -- my point is -- when deciding whether it's good or bad, know what your audience expects and trusts. But don't assume that the same copy will work on everyone. Put a Marlon Sanders ad in front of a buncha coding geeks and his sales will tank.