XP v Vista - Feedback/Comments Wanted

All things being equal...

Which is the overall more User Friendly OS?

I don't care about the 3D Tab display of Vista or those other Cosmetic elements that don't really add functionality but can slow some aspects of the computer down.

I'd just like your opinions - based on your own personal experience or the experience of others or just what you heard.

Michael Ross

This topic has been pretty thoroughly discussed on FIB board recently. Vista is a huge loser unless you're a techie tech with a high tolerance for crapola.

Most people are using 98 or XP Pro unless they're converting to Macintosh. I wish Macs would come down in price...or I'd get wealthy enough to afford to change over everything. Would probably still need a dual machine tho' since some sites will only display, and some programs needed will only work, on a PC. UGH!

IMHO I think most folks are going to have to make their software BOTH PC and Mac compatible before long. Microsoft keeps acting like the A-holes they've always been and not respecting their customer's property rights and so on...and a lot of folks are just plain fed up with their B.S. A Mac works...period...and they don't expect their customers to sweat out the gotcha's like MS does. Sounds like paradise to me.

I'm using XP Pro but Lee has XP Home. Pro beats Home by a country mile and then some. Can't believe how idiotic Home is...heck, Pro is bad enough at frustrating one's efforts to do what could be done easily in Win 98. Sometimes I wish I had my 98 back again. Inadequate for current stuff but at least when it threw a fit I could get it back running right again 99% of the time. With XP it's hit and miss. No, the rollback feature does NOT 'restore everything and put the machine back to the way it was'. That, too, is one of Microsoft's 'white lies'.

I'm at the point I almost always assume the opposite of what Microsoft says...and I'm more often than not, right!

Sandi Bowman

Originally Posted by MichaelRoss

All things being equal...

Which is the overall more User Friendly OS?

I don't care about the 3D Tab display of Vista or those other Cosmetic elements that don't really add functionality but can slow some aspects of the computer down.

I'd just like your opinions - based on your own personal experience or the experience of others or just what you heard.

Michael Ross

Hi Michael,

Thanks for the Techie Topic.

The 'word on the street' is that Vista isn't worth diddly squat.
Hear that it's Quite Buggy and not worth making the change.
(As with ALL New Windows' Operating Systems.)

I use Linux and Windows XP Pro.
Linux: Mandrake/Mandriva 2005 Limited Edition, and SuSE 10.2
So far, I prefer Mandrake over SuSE because of a 'dual boot' issue
and a partition issue, but it STILL beats ANYTHING Microsoft.

If I didn't need certain Executable Files,
I would have COMPLETELY Scrapped XP / Windows
and just use My Linux OSes.

If You're ASKing about Vista to assist in making a purchasing decision,
Go with XP Pro until Vista get's their Current Bugs Out,
of which, will probably be in a year or two...

... and Nope, I'm personally Not Interested in even Trying Vista, either.
I'll probably use XP Pro and Linux for Years to come.

Hope this Helps.



Christopher

Michael,

One of the Biggest Problems I've come across with Vista, is people that I know who already have other computers with XP and windows 98 operating systems But still went out and bought new computers with Vista OS thinking that Networking them would be No problem...

Good Luck! They Can't even get their Printers to work properly Never mind their Wireless networks...

Stay with “One” OS until All the Vista Bugaboo's are Fixed...

If that ever Happens before Vista's successor Vienna...

Vista's successor now known as "7," due out within three years
http://www.engadget.com/tag/vienna

I feel a new Vista Hotsheet coming...

65 More Windows Vista Mistakes
http://chris.pirillo.com/2006/05/28/...ista-mistakes/
http://chris.pirillo.com/media/2007/...ista-problems/

Phil

Originally Posted by MichaelRoss

All things being equal...

Which is the overall more User Friendly OS?

I don't care about the 3D Tab display of Vista or those other Cosmetic elements that don't really add functionality but can slow some aspects of the computer down.

I'd just like your opinions - based on your own personal experience or the experience of others or just what you heard.

Michael Ross

If you gotta do Windows, then my personal experience is that '2000 Pro SP 4 was the only decent one going. I've recently switched to XP, because MS will stop supporting '2000 soon.

But if you want a REAL machine, bite the bullet and learn BSD (Unix - the OS God uses! :^> )

marye

P.S. Just 'cause I'm not posting much doesn't mean I'm not reading y'all!

Don't want to hijack your thread, Michael, but since Marye brought this up in it, I figured it belonged here. If I'm wrong, my apologies.

Marye, you mentioned BSD for the OS. Since that is an OS for servers (if I'm wrong please correct me) does that mean we'd have to do all the manual patching like they do on the servers? If so, where does one get the patches, info on what's needed and when, and so on?

If I recall correctly, BSD is freely available on the internet but I'd have to look up the sources since it's been so long since I stumbled on to it when I was very much a newbie years ago and didn't fully understand much beyond basics.

Anything you can share would be much appreciated!

Sandi Bowman

Originally Posted by Sandi Bowman

Don't want to hijack your thread, Michael, but since Marye brought this up in it, I figured it belonged here. If I'm wrong, my apologies.

Marye, you mentioned BSD for the OS. Since that is an OS for servers (if I'm wrong please correct me) does that mean we'd have to do all the manual patching like they do on the servers? If so, where does one get the patches, info on what's needed and when, and so on?

If I recall correctly, BSD is freely available on the internet but I'd have to look up the sources since it's been so long since I stumbled on to it when I was very much a newbie years ago and didn't fully understand much beyond basics.

Anything you can share would be much appreciated!

Sandi Bowman

Hi Sandi,

BSD (and any OS of the Unix/Linux persuasion) can be a robust server, given the configuration, so it isn't *necessarily* a server OS.

That said, it/they can serve as workstation OSes, and to a large part eliminate much of the hassle of virii, worms trojans, "drive by" malware installation and a host of other problems that have arisen as a result of the ubiquity of Windows (DIG ALERT! . . . And Microsoft's sloppy coding/response to problems.).

I'm setting up a Freebsd workstation that I intend to replace my Windows machine with for most of my computing.

Installing the OS was fairly simple. Installing programs can be simple, and so can the routines that keep things running smoothly and securely.

HOWEVER!

The habits I've gotten from Windows keep getting in the way. I just deleted something I no longer want. I didn't uninstall it properly, and pieces of it were left lying around. Getting things straightened out so I can install a later version is proving to be a challenge (PITA) because I'm having to really learn how the OS operates.

Almost every program available for Windows can be found for Freebsd, and it's free. The downside is that documentation is minimal because all the work to program is done by someone who just wants to provide the functionality - - and it's perfectly clear to HIM/HER what you need to do to get it working.

Another downside is that since AT&T gave it to the computing world, everybody has his own way of implementing things. Thus, you got Freebsd, OpenBSD, Solaris, Unix, etc. All similar, all good, but now standardization about the things that let programmers develop one program to operate under all of them.

[Unix came to be when 3 guys at Bell Labs were chided for playing games on the computer and hogging cycles needed for work - computing that supported that division of the Labs. They found an old Dec machine that had a whopping 64k of memory and wrote their own operating system - Unix.]

While I'm thoroughly enjoying my "trials and tribulations," I realize that I'm kind of "geeky," with a health dose of OCD.

When I've got it all together, I'll have a robust and very secure system, and I'll be able to run almost anything on it that will run on Windows. I'm willing to dig for enough understanding to make that happen, though I realize that everybody may not want to. (I also build my own computers - geeky, huh?]

There is a repository of all the "stuff" you need to do any patching, building, adding on, whatever. Support is also there, but it's in the form of forums and newslists. It requires participation in those, or at least as I do, googling for my problem and chasing down the answer. For one error message I got the only person in the world who had my exact problem, it seemed, was in Russia, and so was the information on the webpage!

One more downside: Lots of folks in the Unix/Linux communities give lip service to wanting their OS to be more widely used, but few of them know how to think like someone new to the OS. (. . preferring to be "elite" in their own minds, I think) They give answers that are rather cryptic, then refer you to the "man" pages (manual pages - they exist for, and are part of the OS package.)

Trouble is, its a whole 'nuther experience learning to navigate those. I read somewhere that documentation should always be written by someone who doesn't speak english, and translated by someone who doesn't know anything about computers. That's how I feel when I go to the "man" page.

The bright side: I'm having a ball. And along the way, I'm making note of every problem I solve as I learn. If I use something I already know to help solve a problem, I note that too. I'm thinking of putting up a website that explains as much of the ins and outs as I can so those willing to try can have an almost step-by-step path to follow, and somewhere to go for a complete answer.

It (BSD) has come a very long way from what it was when I first got the notion to try it. (I was thrown for a loop when my very own computer demanded that I Login, and wouldn't let me do anything until I did!

"It's ME!" I yelled - - "your OWNER! You do what I TELL you to do!"

It said "Login."

Hope this helps, some.

Marye.
P.S. A good alternative to the hassle is the new Mac with the intel chip. The OS is combination BSD and some other Unix-like stuff, with the nice Apple Gui integrated. You can do Windows, Mac and BSD stuff on it! SWEET!

Thanks a million, Marye! Guess it's more than I'd best bite off for now. Too much on my plate as it is. Nice to know about the alternative Mac etc...it's a definite idea when the time is right.

I'm just soooo fed up with Microsoft anything. I just had to reinstall my firewall because good ol' Gates crew mucked things up again. They keep turning theirs on which messes up my Kerio and and and....Grrrrrr! Yes, I have XP Pro so it should be better...or so everyone says. It would be if Gates's crew would keep their snoopy noses out of MY system...the one I paid for and he has a record of that payment via my registration.

How'd he like it if, every time he crawled into bed, I made him get up, change the sheets, prove he paid for the bed, and had him do l0 jumping jacks before he could use the bed? Same difference, IMHO.

Thanks again, Marye.

Sandi

Originally Posted by Sandi Bowman

Thanks a million, Marye! Guess it's more than I'd best bite off for now. Too much on my plate as it is. Nice to know about the alternative Mac etc...it's a definite idea when the time is right.

I'm just soooo fed up with Microsoft anything. I just had to reinstall my firewall because good ol' Gates crew mucked things up again. They keep turning theirs on which messes up my Kerio and and and....Grrrrrr! Yes, I have XP Pro so it should be better...or so everyone says. It would be if Gates's crew would keep their snoopy noses out of MY system...the one I paid for and he has a record of that payment via my registration.

How'd he like it if, every time he crawled into bed, I made him get up, change the sheets, prove he paid for the bed, and had him do l0 jumping jacks before he could use the bed? Same difference, IMHO.

Thanks again, Marye.

Sandi

Hi again,

On the XP Firewall: I turned it off as well. I mean, if you can't manage to keep gaping holes out of the operating system itself before it goes to production, why would I think your johnny-come-lately firewall was any good?

I downloaded both Kerio and a firewall called Safety.net. I installed the latter first, and was so happy with it that I never installed Kerio. It's small, effective, and doesn't XP Pro doesn't interfere with it. If you have problems with the XP Pro, I recommend you try Safety.net.

Marye

Thanks, Marye. Took your advice and downloaded the personal one to try safety.net. Can always go back to Kerio, if needed, as I have a paid for copy of it. BTW, if anyone is trying to find safety.net, it can be found at http://www.netveda.com/

The reason I turn off MS firewall is because Gates is 'in bed' with Gator/Claria et al...and that makes it a huge bad joke IMHO. I've been told it's only a one-way firewall at that so...only partial protection, if anything.

Sandi