Fastest way to double $500, $1000, $2500, $5000, $10000?

Hi all,

Just what would you think would be the fastest (and generally safe) way to double these amounts if you had them to invest?

Best,

Paul

dno
> Hi all,

> Just what would you think would be the
> fastest (and generally safe) way to double
> these amounts if you had them to invest?

> Best,

> Paul

Hi Paul,

That's an interesting question (as Boyd said)....

What I can think of is that you can double these amounts through chatteling. Chatteling is interesting because it's "scalable".... You can turn $5 into $10, or $5,000 into $10,000 (though it may take a few trades to do that)....

One businessman who has made his initial fortune mostly from chatteling is Kirk Kerkorian. He's best known for having bought and sold MGM several times (I think he owns it right now). I find him a fascinating entrepreneur, so I have studied his life to a small degree....

Kirk Kerkorian started as a teenager, buying cars, fixing them up, and reselling them. During WWII, he worked as a civilian airline pilot for the British air force, flying planes from Canada to the UK. After the war, he went back into chatteling, buying and selling planes!

Kirk Kerkorian always looks for the "hidden value" - finding the value which is there, and which others don't see....

I personally think that chatteling may be the fastest way to do it - but you have to be willing to spend your money (to buy stuff), and you have to study the market first, so you don't lose money instead!

Of course, what you buy and sell could differ for these different amounts.... In the $500 range you might be looking at furniture, while in the $5000 range you might be looking at cars.... It's helpful (though not compulsory) to have a van or trailer to move stuff with.

I recently got John McTighe's report, and along with Gordon Alexander's report, they are both excellent reports on chatteling. I highly recommend both of them. :)

(I don't make any profit from mentioning either of these reports, by the way - they are both genuinely good....)

- Dien Rice


The source of many great ideas.... :)

Dien,

As you often do you've shown light on two crucial issues.

I hadn't considered the importance of scalability in one's endeavors, so I thank you for mentioning it.

As for "hidden value" all I have to say is that seeing "hidden value" and exploiting it is the key to the vaults of Croesus.

I personally find it extremely difficult to see--I bet there are pockets of hidden value in what I know, and what I know how to do, that if I could just mine them out making money would be a very easy thing to do, indeed.

Best,

- Boyd

Enter these amounts into your financial calculator and multiply them by two :o)

Of course, you just end up with numbers that way.

For actual dollars you would have to use a spreadsheet that showed the dollar amounts - :o) :o)

Now to answer your question for real...

The answer to the question would make a Great special report. Because all it would take is an initial investment of $500. Then, when you've turned that $500 into $1,000, you re-invest the lot until it is $2,000. Then re-invest the $2,000 and it becomes $4,000. Then re-invest the $4,000 until it is $8,000. And so on... "How To Turn $500 Into $32,000 In X Days"

But the thing is... what do YOU consider to be Safe.

If you want "safety"... put your money in the bank or a government secured "investment vehicle." Of course, the rate of return will be small. And if you get a 5% return it will only take a little over 14 years to double your money.

Also, are you thinking along the lines of the return on Your Cash Investment, or on the investment overall?

Because if it's Your Cash you are mainly interested in, then there are ways to get returns of infinity... in real estate... using borrowed money and none of your own...

And also in other areas...

A little while back John McTighe told a story about making $1,490 with ZERO money invested. Of course, he had about six hours of "sweat equity" in the deal. So his hourly rate works out to be $248.33 per hour - you can read his story here: http://www.sowpub.com/cgi-bin/forum/webbbs_config.pl?read=6490

But from a Cash on Cash Return his return is infinity because he invested no cash.

He also tells a story of finding car for $300 and flipping it for $700 within the week.

And to see what three millionaires did when they had $10,000 to invest, read this post series: http://www.sowpub.com/cgi-bin/forum/webbbs_config.pl?read=2053

No matter which way you cut it though, the fastest and safest return will be to buy something and then sell it.

The amount of return you want will determine whether you buy before you sell, buy after you have made the sale or sell without actually buying.

You could, of course, Short Stock - could be very risky if you do not know what you are doing.

Or Trade Currency Futures - Here's a post where one guy turned $10,000 into $187,000 in one day: http://www.sowpub.com/cgi-bin/forum/webbbs_config.pl?read=1627 - again a high risk venture.

But risk and safety are matters of opinion. I do not know how to cover my downside with Shorting Stock or Trading Futures and this is why I consider them risky.

Then again, I also consider having one single, solitary source of income as risky too.

You have asked a very good question. A question that we should all ask ourselves - and answer. Because to know beforehand what we will do in certain circumstances is valuable knowledge.

Your Question and

My Challenge...

“Imagine this... you are out of work, have no money coming in whatsoever and cannot get any on credit cards or in any other way. You are too proud to go on welfare, have no products to sell, no customer list, refuse to get money selling your body for sex, refuse to get a job working for someone else for a wage and you refuse to sell any of your possessions. Knowing what you know now, who you know now and having the resources you currently have at your disposal, what would you do to get yourself back on your feet before you ran out of money?

You only have $1,000 left.”

...good to have an answer for... (How To Start To Answer My Challenge)

Michael Ross


Find the answers you are looking for here...

> Hi Paul,

> That's an interesting question (as Boyd
> said)....

> What I can think of is that you can double
> these amounts through chatteling. Chatteling
> is interesting because it's
> "scalable".... You can turn $5
> into $10, or $5,000 into $10,000 (though it
> may take a few trades to do that)....

Yes, I had a pretty good idea someone would match up chatteling to this question. I agree that if you know what you're doing, chatteling would be an excellent way of doubling your money with little risk.

Best,

Paul

> Enter these amounts into your financial
> calculator and multiply them by two :o)

There's a smart aleck in every crowd! ;-)

> But the thing is... what do YOU consider to
> be Safe.

That's dependent on the person of course -- I'm sure we all have a comfort zone somewhere between placing a bet on a horse race and putting the money in US Treasury Notes.

> Also, are you thinking along the lines of
> the return on Your Cash Investment, or on
> the investment overall?

No, you're complicating things. I have $500 in my pocket. I want $1000 in my pocket. What's the fastest way to get there? I don't care if I invest $50 to get the additional $500, or the whole $500 I have -- the object is to get $1000.

> Because if it's Your Cash you are mainly
> interested in, then there are ways to get
> returns of infinity... in real estate...
> using borrowed money and none of your own...

Yeah, but I don't care about "ROI", what I DO care about is "how much money do I have". If someone gives me a bag of aluminum cans and I sell them to the local recycling plant for $15.00, then my ROI is infinite, but I'm still $485 short of turning my $500 into $1000

> No matter which way you cut it though, the
> fastest and safest return will be to buy
> something and then sell it.

Ah, now we're getting to the ANSWER to my question! Looks like it's another vote for chatteling! :o)

> The amount of return you want will determine
> whether you buy before you sell, buy after
> you have made the sale or sell without
> actually buying.

Again, I only care about how quickly I can turn that $500 into $1000.

> You could, of course, Short Stock - could be
> very risky if you do not know what you are
> doing.

> Or Trade Currency Futures - Here's a post
> where one guy turned $10,000 into $187,000
> in one day:
> http://www.sowpub.com/cgi-bin/forum/webbbs_config.pl?read=1627
> - again a high risk venture.

For sure!

> Then again, I also consider having one
> single, solitary source of income as risky
> too.

And oddly enough that's how most people live their lives.

> “Imagine this... you are out of work, have
> no money coming in whatsoever and cannot get
> any on credit cards or in any other way. You
> are too proud to go on welfare, have no
> products to sell, no customer list, refuse
> to get money selling your body for sex,
> refuse to get a job working for someone else
> for a wage and you refuse to sell any of
> your possessions. Knowing what you know now,
> who you know now and having the resources
> you currently have at your disposal, what
> would you do to get yourself back on your
> feet before you ran out of money?

> You only have $1,000 left.”

Whew, that's a hard one . . . I'd have to break out the books! There's all kinds of odd jobs you could do to survive (window washing, curb painting, car washes, etc.), but none of those make much use of my programming skills . . .

I suppose I'd start by contacting the internet marketers I know and asking them what kind of programming projects they might be interested in.

OR find a popular CGI script, make a better one, and start selling it.

VERY thought provoking question -- especially in these times!

Best,

Paul

Hi Boyd,

> I hadn't considered the importance of
> scalability in one's endeavors, so I thank
> you for mentioning it.

Boyd, I think "scalability" is very important!

By "scalability" I mean - can your business easily and "naturally" grow? Or are you limited to a certain size?

For example, let's say your business is fixing some very obscure piece of equipment. Because of the difficulty in getting these fixed, you can probably charge a very high hourly rate for your services. But is your business "scalable"?

Probably, it's not - because it's highly dependent on your VERY specialized skill, and you can only help one customer at a time. If it's very hard to find people with your specialized skill, then it's hard to employ others to help with the work. You're stuck with earning an hourly wage.... Since there are only a limited number of hours in a week, there's a "cap" on how much your business can make!

BUT - let's say you take that skill, and turn it into a newsletter or membership web site. Then, that business is "scalable", in the sense you can earn more money, by getting more subscribers. The more subscribers you get, your profits increase for the same amount of work.

OR, let's take a service business which doesn't require much skills. Let's say it's mowing lawns.... Then, it becomes scalable, because to expand, you can hire other people to mow lawns for your business. Your skill is not so "specialized" that you can't hire others to do the work....

I think "mail order" style businesses are all "scalable".... Especially if you have a built-in base of subscribers (such as through a catalog).

I think about "scalability" in everything I do.... I think it's often easier (at the beginning) to start a "non-scalable" business.... However, I've purposely avoided that, because my plan is to keep growing my successful businesses. I don't want to hit a wall I can't pass!

I think it's a very important topic to think about.... :)

> As for "hidden value" all I have
> to say is that seeing "hidden
> value" and exploiting it is the key to
> the vaults of Croesus.

> I personally find it extremely difficult to
> see--I bet there are pockets of hidden value
> in what I know, and what I know how to do,
> that if I could just mine them out making
> money would be a very easy thing to do,
> indeed.

I think this is largely experience, and being alert to them.... I guess I'm getting to the stage where I'm now always thinking of opportunities in what's around me.... (Though I think Michael Ross is a true master of this, IMHO - I've been learning from him. :) )

Here's an Australian example.... I've noticed on eBay, people here in Australia sell second-hand Australian magazines (often women's magazines) to US bidders for about US$5, plus $5 postage. I can buy these second-hand magazines here for about US 25c to 50c each - most people throw them away. They don't know they can sell them for 10 to 20 times that amount on eBay. There's an opportunity (at least a local Australian one)....

The "hidden value" is because these magazines are abundant here in Australia, but difficult to get overseas.... Hence the "hidden value" of these magazines comes from selling them to overseas bidders (who live where these magazines are scarce).

How can you use this where you are? What is easy - even abundant - where you live, yet difficult to get elsewhere? That could be a possible opportunity.... I remember seeing one guy on eBay who sold lots of Las Vegas casino memorabilia.... It's probably very easy for him to get it (maybe he even gets some of it for free), because this guy lives in Las Vegas. Yet, it's NOT easy for others who live elsewhere to get these things, so he can sell these to them at a profit.

Here are some examples of the kind of thing I mean.... Check through this guy's auctions. He's selling Las Vegas memorabilia (especially ashtrays).... And guess where he lives? If you click on any of his auctions, you'll see he lives in - Las Vegas! He can probably pick this stuff up really cheaply in Las Vegas (or maybe even get it free), and sell it for a profit on eBay to people outside Las Vegas.... Many people in Las Vegas probably consider these "worthless", but this guy sees the "hidden value" of these to people who live outside of Las Vegas....

Another great example is the Gary Hendrickson's post below about aspirin tins.... More "hidden value" there....

There are opportunities all around you. But to see them, I think it takes a certain mind-set, so that you are always looking for them.... After a while, it starts to become "instinctive".... :)

- Dien

Hi Boyd,

I thought I'd add another example.... :)

I have a friend here who's been very successful in property investment.... He's succeeded because he's become an "expert" at seeing the "hidden value" in second-hand houses....

He likes to buy timber (wooden) houses - because often there is more "hidden value" there than with brick homes.

Here's the essence of his technique.... He looks for houses which are well-constructed and "solid" - that don't have any structural problems. But, he also looks for homes which may look pretty awful.... Maybe the paint is peeling, or simply just an awful paint job. Perhaps the carpet is ripped up....

The key is, all these things are "cosmetic" problems. Struturally, the house is sound....

He finds that many people don't want to buy these homes, because they look terrible. That means, he can buy them cheap!

After he buys them - you guessed it - he fixes them up. He repaints it, puts in new carpet, and does other "cosmetic" improvements. Note that NONE of these are "structural" improvements - this is where a lot of people who plan to do "fixer-uppers" go wrong! "Structural" improvemnents can be a nightmare - so he sticks to houses which need "cosmetic" improvements only!

It doesn't take him very long or much money to fix these problems.... Afterwards, he can rent the house out for a higher rental rate than it's ever been rented out before. Because the house suddenly looks great!

He sees the "hidden value" in a house with a good, solid structure, yet which has many "cosmetic" problems which are easily fixable. He's been able to get a couple of "bargain" houses that way.... He's done very well by doing this!

- Dien Rice

Hi,

You wrote:
> The amount of return you want will determine
> whether you buy before you sell, buy after
> you have made the sale or sell without
> actually buying.

You also wrote:
> I do not know how to cover my downside with
> Shorting Stock or Trading Futures and this
> is why I consider them risky.

In chatteling I know you guys trade futures. When you agree to sell someone a black 1991 Cadillac for $5000, to be delivered in two weeks, then take the $5000 and buy a Caddy that fits the description for $4700 and pocket the $300 profit, what you've done is sold a futures contract. You sold something you don't own, and whether you make a profit or not depends on if you can "buy back the contract" for less than you sold it for. In futures trading you win if you either:

* Buy Low and Sell High, or

* Sell High and Buy Low.

Either way is equally good.

Best,

- Boyd