Dumb question... but is it legally okay to resell other's works?

Hi Gordon:

> The CHATTELING COURSE will be available in
> June. It will cost 197 dollars and include
> an audio, video, workbook and other goodies.
> What I'm looking for is to TRADE with anyone
> for any course they paid at least 197
> dollars for.

Dumb question, perhaps, but is it legally okay to barter (or trade) someone else's copyrighted work in return for an item of value.

If a dentist trades a root canal for your marketing course, you are each trading your own goods.

That's not the case if the dentist is giving you something that he does not own the copyright to, is it?

With software, that would be considered theft and piracy. But with print materials? Ebooks?

Let's say the marketing course is in printed format. If I go to Coles' and buy a Stephen King book and finish reading it, I am free to give it to someone else. But am I allowed to resell it and make a profit on it?

I don't think that's legally kocher, although I'm not really sure, and I do know that people do it at garage sales every weekend.

When it comes to infoproducts, though, which is a pretty touchy market to begin with, is the person that bought the "other" courses allowed to give them to you?

Perhaps they are, and it's a-okay to trade people's copyrighted work. I really don't know... but I thought it worth mentioning as food for thought, anyway.

Maybe the best idea would be for anyone interested in the trade to check the policies on the package they purchased to be sure?

Food for thought if nothing else.

: )
Linda

NEW YORK, NY - Today, Government officials closed down every second hand bookstore and charity store for selling copyrighted products without the author's or publisher's permission.

And just when you think it is okay to get your books from the library as well, they have also all been shut down for giving the books away to many many people without paying royalties each time the book is taken out.

They have also shut down the second hand book operation of Amazon. And eBay has been given 24 hours to close any and all auctions relating to books - be they collectors books or not.

And they have their sites aimed to hit the garage sales next weekend.

But their madness doesn't end there.

They have also began closing down Doctor's surgeries because of the magazines freely available for reading in the waiting room. Unless the surgeries can come up with back royalties, they will not be allowed to open again.

And on the horizon: work place lunch rooms and book clubs. "We are aware of the rampant book sharing that goes on in these places. And these people are depriving the authors of their rightful royalties each time a book is passed around."

And once these "operations" have been closed, they will be moving on to the auction houses to make sure no books are sold there either.

Film at 11.

HA!

:o)

Michael Ross.

Hi:

Joke if you want. If I posted an ad on the forums all over the web saying I'd bought a copy of Marlon Sander's course (or anyone else's for that matter) and was selling it at a profit - would he be okay with that?

Let's say I bought the package that costs over a grand and was selling it for $197. Is that okay?

People at garage sales, etc, are selling their "original" copy (such as with any printed material)... but if the material is digital?

What's to prevent me from making a copy of a digital product and keeping mine?

Then I'm reproducing the work for profit.

There is a huge difference between selling off an old paper book - and selling someone's digital product.

Joke if you want to.... scoff if you want to... but I have a legitimate question. Jokes don't make it any less so.

Oh... digital.

Sorry. I misread.

I took Gordon's request to mean paper and ink (or other hard products) and not digital. And being traded and not sold. Just two people swapping what they had. It could be clothes or TVs or anything, but in this case it was books/videos/audios.

And when I read your words about garage sales and Stephen King books I thought...

But digital... now THAT IS a different matter. And in that case I think you would have to view it as software. For your personal use only.

Michael Ross.

Linda -

> Dumb question, perhaps, but is it legally
> okay to barter (or trade) someone else's
> copyrighted work in return for an item of
> value.

Quite legal. Just like trading in a car on a different model. The copyright, as long as you don't violate it by copying illegally, has *nothing* to do with it. There are bookstores that will take your old paperbacks in trade for newer ones.

> That's not the case if the dentist is giving
> you something that he does not own the
> copyright to, is it?

Again, the copyright has nothing to do with it.

> With software, that would be considered
> theft and piracy. But with print materials?
> Ebooks?

Nope. It's *not* piracy with software. In fact, *many* software licenses state that you may transfer the license as long as you transfer all materials and remove it from your machine. It's piracy when you make a copy, trade or sell that, and keep a copy on your machine as well.

> Let's say the marketing course is in printed
> format. If I go to Coles' and buy a Stephen
> King book and finish reading it, I am free
> to give it to someone else. But am I allowed
> to resell it and make a profit on it?

Gordon's talking about *trading* info products. Nobody's selling anything. Besides, it's most certainly legal to resell used info products. Ever heard of bookstores selling used books? *g* What's the difference?

> I don't think that's legally kocher,
> although I'm not really sure, and I do know
> that people do it at garage sales every
> weekend.

As I explained above, there are no legal nor moral ramifications to anything we discussed above.

> When it comes to infoproducts, though, which
> is a pretty touchy market to begin with, is
> the person that bought the "other"
> courses allowed to give them to you?

Same answer as before. As long I give or sell you the complete product, I'm in good shape morally and legally. Used infoproducts are sold on eBay all the time. And why do you think infoproducts is a "touchy market?" What does that mean?

> Maybe the best idea would be for anyone
> interested in the trade to check the
> policies on the package they purchased to be
> sure?

Typically, the only "policy" I see on the infoproducts *I* purchase is the copyright. And to find out the specifics of copyright law, you can visit www.loc.gov. There's a link there that will take you to the Copyright Office page where you can download PDFs that explain copyright law in great detail.

Rick Smith, "The Net Guerrilla"


Click Here to Get a Great New Life In 10 Days

Linda -

> Joke if you want. If I posted an ad on the
> forums all over the web saying I'd bought a
> copy of Marlon Sander's course (or anyone
> else's for that matter) and was selling it
> at a profit - would he be okay with that?

Gordon is talking about *trading* packages, not selling. No profit will change hands.

> Let's say I bought the package that costs
> over a grand and was selling it for $197. Is
> that okay?

It's done all the time.

> People at garage sales, etc, are selling
> their "original" copy (such as
> with any printed material)... but if the
> material is digital?

Again, the copyright law applies the same to digital infoproducts as it does to hard copy. The only thing that's different is the delivery medium.

> What's to prevent me from making a copy of a
> digital product and keeping mine?

Now *that* is in violation of copyright law and is *not* what we're discussing when we talk about trading or selling used infoproducts.

> Then I'm reproducing the work for profit.

Nope. Then you're violating copyright law.

> There is a huge difference between selling
> off an old paper book - and selling
> someone's digital product.

What *is* the difference? They're both infoproducts. The copyright law applies the same to both. The only difference is the delivery medium.

> Joke if you want to.... scoff if you want
> to... but I have a legitimate question.
> Jokes don't make it any less so.

Please don't take it personally. I won't speak for Mike but I've known him from a number of online venues for a number of years. I suspect he was merely making his point in his own way.

Rick Smith, "The Net Guerrilla"


Get a Great New Life in Only 10 Days

Mike -

> But digital... now THAT IS a different
> matter. And in that case I think you would
> have to view it as software. For your
> personal use only.

It's not necessarily different. E-books are simply a different delivery medium as compared to hard copy infoproducts.

Besides, I'm sure you're aware as a software author, *many* software licenses allow for the transfer of the license as long as the original purchaser keeps no copies of any kind. There are also *many* licenses that don't allow transfer.

One of the best licenses I ever saw was the Borland license from the old days.

Intellectual property law WRT software has been debated hotly for many years. And I don't think the battle's over yet.

Rick Smith, "The Net Guerrilla"


Get a Great New Life in Only 10 Days

Rick:

> Besides, I'm sure you're aware as a software
> author, *many* software licenses allow for
> the transfer of the license as long as the
> original purchaser keeps no copies of any
> kind. There are also *many* licenses that
> don't allow transfer.

Yes. Good point. My software licenses allow for a transfer as long as the original is not kept. Pretty standard stuff, IMO.

> One of the best licenses I ever saw was the
> Borland license from the old days.

Do you recall anything about it? What made is to good?

Michael Ross.

Mike -

> Yes. Good point. My software licenses allow
> for a transfer as long as the original is
> not kept. Pretty standard stuff, IMO.

Correct. It *is* pretty standard stuff. And I can't recall *any* of them saying *anything* about it being a violation of the license to sell used, trade, give away, or whatever. As you indicated, the word used is "transfer." And IMO, unless the definition is explicity stated, "transfer" can legally mean any of the things we've discussed on this thread.

> Do you recall anything about it? What made
> is to good?

One of the things I think was in that license was their example of what "transferring" the license meant. (If they didn't use it, it was in another license and is still a good example.) They said that it worked just like a book. If you bought a book, read it, and then passed it on to a friend, you wouldn't be able to read the same book at the same time unless of course you copied the book, (or in actuality the software), in which case the copyright would be violated.

Rick Smith, "The Net Guerrilla"


Get a Great New Life for Yourself in 10 Days