Getting things done with "nested" to-do lists...

[Dien Rice]

A couple months ago, I started using "nested" to-do lists - and I've found it very helpful, so I thought I would share my experience here...

For some people, this may be obvious. However, for some it could really help...!

My to-do lists used to be like what many people do... I just had a single list, like a shopping list, of what I wanted to do that day, or that week...

The problem with that, was that everything was jumbled up - from different projects. So, buying the milk was mixed in with writing articles, which was mixed in with starting new business projects, which was mixed in with washing the car...

Because I wear a lot of "hats" and do many different things (as many of us do!), it didn't give me "clarity" on what I was doing - and also wasn't very motivational. I couldn't really see the progress I was making on various things, because they were all jumbled up...

Now, I have a much better system...

My to-do list is split into different categories, and "nested"...

(I call these "nested to-do lists" as they look a little bit like "nested loops" in programming...)

For example, Here's what part of my to-do list looked like recently... (I say it looked like this recently, because I've already fixed the dripping tap now. I've written the press release, but haven't sent it out yet, so I'm still working on that project...)

• Fix dripping tap
  • Get wrench
  • Shut off outside water
  • Undo tap
  • Buy replacement washers, o-rings
  • Put everything back together
  • Turn outside water back on
• Write press release for my friend John's restaurant, about his pies (to help him out)
  • Interview John
  • Write press release in point form, first paragraph should answer 5 W's
  • Arrange in order from most important to least important
  • Finalize draft of press release
  • Format the press release the right way (with John's contact information)
  • Make list of newspapers to contact, and their phone numbers
    • The Age
    • The Herald-Sun
    • (etc.)
  • Call all the newspapers, to get the contact name to send it to, and how they'd like to receive it
  • Send the press release, the way they want to receive it (e.g. via email, etc.)
• (Many more items here...)

To help organize this, I use Workflowy - http://workflowy.com ...

I can now easily cross off the parts I have done, as I do them.

Also, as I do it, I can see at a glance exactly where I am in that "project" - whether I still have many steps to do, or whether I'm near the end.

I have another section for completed projects - so once I've done all the steps in a project, I move the whole project to that section (so it's out of the way).

This seems to work for me, whether the project would take a day, take a week, or month, or even many months... It's nice to be able to see how I'm "progressing" on each project at a glance (as I cross off each step as I do it)...

Workflowy (which is free) helps with this because you can easily add new items or new steps, cross off what you've done, you can have unlimited levels of "nesting" (I have 3 levels in the press release project above), and you can also easily move things around... You can also "collapse" the sub-lists you don't want to see (so you don't get distracted by them)...

Anyway, I thought I'd share this... Having these more "organized" to-do lists has really helped with getting things done, and I've found it much more motivational, too...

Does anyone have any techniques or methods which have helped them to get things completed they can post... Now here was one of mine. I'll rack my brains for more.

Best wishes,

Dien

Hi Dien:

Similar but different.

I prefer using pen and paper for daily lists.

I have a raft of spiral bound science notebooks for kid's classes and use them....some may remember them....lines on half and blank on the other for diagrams.

Being a single parent I also wear way too many hats and while work is precedence, there also kid and houshold needs going on every day.

The daily list....the lined section is work related....on the blank are household / kids.

As things are completed they are crossed off.

I should mention the blank space is also used for phone call notations from calls during the day, sudden ideas, or web site design ideas (quickly sketched out), etc..

Where I go a little differently is that if I have a master heading on the list (such as report, ebook, newsletter, web site design - ones that require many steps to finish)...I use separate sheets for these (attached to daily list with paperclips)... this way I don't have to continually recopy them.....and they eventually become part of the portfolio on the project.

Every night before shutting down for the day I go to the list and create tomorrow's. Items not crossed off become priority the next day if absolutely pressing and most done the next day at some point....very few are carried over to a third or fourth day (the exception is larger projects which may take several days / weeks to complete - they just get repeated on the list until done and then crossed off)

I find this works for me...especially with the side notes as they are on a dated page...and all lists are kept.

Pen and paper don't crash, and paper doesn't get corrupted and won't open...just a couple of reasons I still rely on the pen.

C.

Originally Posted by Cornell

Pen and paper don't crash, and paper doesn't get corrupted and won't open...just a couple of reasons I still rely on the pen.

C.

And it doesn't need to be turned on, or charged up.
.

Originally Posted by Cornell

Pen and paper don't crash, and paper doesn't get corrupted and won't open...just a couple of reasons I still rely on the pen.

C.

Is not effected when the power goes out and requires no tech support.

I still use my trusty Franklin Covey Planner. I too like the fact that I don't need batteries or connectivity to stay organized

[Dien Rice]

Originally Posted by Cornell

Hi Dien:

Similar but different.

I prefer using pen and paper for daily lists.

Hi Cornell,

Your method sounds pretty good!

I like your idea of using a notebook which is lined on one side, and blank on the other... I also like your idea of paperclipping other lists for projects to the page, too!

I also prefer paper and ink, if I can make it work. More portable, etc.

As it is, I'm online so often, that using an online solution (Workflowy) is not too inconvenient... I do like the fact you can easily move things around, and rearrange things.

I was thinking of doing something like that to some extent by sticking post-it notes into a notebook (so I could move the post-it notes around on the notebook page, or move them to separate pages). I never actually tried it - I was worried that the post-it notes could too easily fall out, and get lost!

Then I had the idea to try one of those old "stamp collecting" books - I could put the notes in the little clear "sleeve" where the stamps would normally be! Then, I could still move them around - but I think they would be less likely to fall out. I never did try that either (I couldn't find where to buy those stamp books - though I finally found that the post office still sold them)... Though I still think it's probably a good idea...

Thanks Cornell, for sharing! I think we can all gain if we can share these kinds of practical ideas...

Best wishes,

Dien

Hi Dien:

Yes this works for me.

I keep all the notebooks...actually have two fire resistant 4 drawer filing cabinets full of them.

I have been doing web sites for 14 years now...and I still get a few clients from those early years coming back to do changes or additions, or needing troubleshooting. By having these notebooks and portfolios I can simply pull them and know exactly what had been done previously....and trust me... the memory ain't what it used to be so these are definitely a help.

Also if there is a dispute about a time frame I can pull the dates in question and verify my notations to make sure I am correct and not mistaken.

I also have used the post-its (sticky notes)...they actually work pretty well...after a couple of pulls and placements they seem to fall off easily but I find a paper clip secures them after that....and if they need to become a permanent part of records - a staple takes care of that.

Actually the frame of my monitor could be an advertisement for post-its....it is adorned with them to remind me about critical time and date sensitive happenings.

Have endured numerous hard drive crashes...and way back when backups were done on tape had the tapes de-spool and the backup be garbage.

Just recently I went through a complete loss by a huge power spike. At the time it hit I had my second computer doing a backup and also my external backup drives running their backup. Surge supressor apparently failed to stop it. As a result both computers fried (including hard drives) as well as my external drives. Spent 4 weeks recovering data from damaged drives with 60% of it unusable....tremendous loss...but...all my pen and paper records were intact.

I like Duane's egg timer idea...will have to give that a try.

I have another little item I use...it drives my kids nuts....it is called Sound Pilot (http://www.colorpilot.com/soundpilot.html).

When I was in high school one of the language classes I wanted was full and needed another class to fill my schedule...so looked for a 'bird class' (no brainer, easy, and no homework)...took a commercial stream course - beginner's typing. The instructor used a device similar to a metronome (piano teaching accessory) to give us a pace to type to and as it sped up so did we....with goal of 50 words per minute....I never quite made it...best was only 42. That device emitted the same sound as the Sound Pilot does when a key is hit.....so now I just turn it on and as it emits the sound of a typewriter key I use it to get myself in a quick easy pace for keying in on the computer.

I have tried Dragon Naturally Speaking but with dismal success. My workspace has too many varying background noises to use it successfully and have it come out relatively correct...found it took longer to edit than to just key it in.

C.

[Dien Rice]

Hi Cornell,

Originally Posted by Cornell

Yes this works for me.

I keep all the notebooks...actually have two fire resistant 4 drawer filing cabinets full of them.

I have been doing web sites for 14 years now...and I still get a few clients from those early years coming back to do changes or additions, or needing troubleshooting. By having these notebooks and portfolios I can simply pull them and know exactly what had been done previously....and trust me... the memory ain't what it used to be so these are definitely a help.

Also if there is a dispute about a time frame I can pull the dates in question and verify my notations to make sure I am correct and not mistaken.

Apparently Richard Branson does something similar!

In his book, he says...

"As anyone in my office knows when I’ve lost it, my most essential possession is a standard-sized school notebook, which can be bought at any stationery shop on any high street across the country. I carry this everywhere and write down comments made to me by Virgin staff and anyone else I meet. I make notes of all telephone conversations and all meetings, and I draft out letters to send and lists of telephone calls to make. Over the years I have worked my way through a bookcase of them, and the discipline of writing everything down ensures that I have to listen to people carefully."

From an old post, here - http://www.sowpub.com/forum/showthread.php?p=12318

(Also a little more here - http://www.sowpub.com/forum/showthread.php?p=9757 )

I also have used the post-its (sticky notes)...they actually work pretty well...after a couple of pulls and placements they seem to fall off easily but I find a paper clip secures them after that....and if they need to become a permanent part of records - a staple takes care of that.

Actually the frame of my monitor could be an advertisement for post-its....it is adorned with them to remind me about critical time and date sensitive happenings.

Have endured numerous hard drive crashes...and way back when backups were done on tape had the tapes de-spool and the backup be garbage.

Just recently I went through a complete loss by a huge power spike. At the time it hit I had my second computer doing a backup and also my external backup drives running their backup. Surge supressor apparently failed to stop it. As a result both computers fried (including hard drives) as well as my external drives. Spent 4 weeks recovering data from damaged drives with 60% of it unusable....tremendous loss...but...all my pen and paper records were intact.

Yes - digital info seems to be fragile!

Backups are essential! A few years ago, my hard drive on my laptop went dead. Fortunately, I had just backed up a couple days before it happened, so I only lost a couple days of data. (Including an article I had been writing - which was annoying - but it could have been much worse!)

Nowadays, I'm also using "Carbonite" - http://www.carbonite.com . This is a paid solution ($59/year). It's a web-based automated backup service. I use it to keep my key files backed up as well. The nice thing about it is you don't have to think about it - it works automatically in the background. (I still do full backups too - though perhaps less often.)

Another good thing about Carbonite is that if a file is accidentally erased or overwritten (so you can't get it back) - you can often retrieve it from your Carbonite backup.

I like Duane's egg timer idea...will have to give that a try.

I have another little item I use...it drives my kids nuts....it is called Sound Pilot (http://www.colorpilot.com/soundpilot.html).

When I was in high school one of the language classes I wanted was full and needed another class to fill my schedule...so looked for a 'bird class' (no brainer, easy, and no homework)...took a commercial stream course - beginner's typing. The instructor used a device similar to a metronome (piano teaching accessory) to give us a pace to type to and as it sped up so did we....with goal of 50 words per minute....I never quite made it...best was only 42. That device emitted the same sound as the Sound Pilot does when a key is hit.....so now I just turn it on and as it emits the sound of a typewriter key I use it to get myself in a quick easy pace for keying in on the computer.

I have tried Dragon Naturally Speaking but with dismal success. My workspace has too many varying background noises to use it successfully and have it come out relatively correct...found it took longer to edit than to just key it in.

Regarding Dragon Naturally Speaking - I'm with you. I find it takes more time fixing up the errors to not make it worth it. However, other people swear by it.

I've used a transcription service in the past, though haven't used one for a while. I found that worked well. (For example, I've written articles that way.)

I did use Sound Pilot too, it was cool! I don't have it now - I think it disappeared with that hard drive crash I mentioned earlier. However, it was nice. I think I'll re-install it!

I'm a "sucker" for re-creating the "typewriting" experience. I remember enjoying writing by typing on a typewriter...

Actually, I got out an old typewriter recently (my late father's old Hermes 3000 - he loved that model of typewriter; at one stage he had several of them). I used it to address an envelope, which is one of the things a typewriter is better at than a computer or printer - because you can position it accurately on the envelope!



I found that my finger muscles aren't strong enough to touch type at a fast pace on a manual typewriter any more. I used to be able to do it! But all these years of using "soft" computer keyboards has meant my typing finger muscles have withered away!

Thanks Cornell... Great stuff in your post. And I think I'll get Sound Pilot again!

(I'm sure many "younger folks" will all think adding typewriter sounds to a computer is "crazy"...! )

Best wishes,

Dien

Tick, Tick, Tick, Tick

As the Tick of the egg timer goes...I feel a growing INTENSITY to complete this post ASAP.

Hi Dien,

First THANK YOU for sharing your new Tool Workflowy. I have actually checked it out and think it will work well with quickly planning out Projects etc. etc.

As many of the members noted, I too prefer old-school paper and pen. As it is portable...and I just don't "Think" very well when on the computer. (Although as stated I am testing out workflowy).

You Asked for any "Techniques or methods that have helped to get things completed. Yes.

1. EGG TIMER

Think Eugene Schwartz put me onto this productivity tool. I set up a 20 min. timeblock to get certain groups of tasks done i.e FB, Emails. Even right now. It is going as I type this. Just the sound alone put me into an intense mode. I'm using a REAL EGG TIMER. I think somebody posted on Sowpub earlier about this tool. If you want an online version (great for if you are in a public place use http://e.ggtimer.com/)

2. Blank coiled black notepad with just plain paper. Like in school.
The ones I like are by a company called Blueline

3. Brendon Burchard's Technique I like. Every Day I write out the following Subjects

PROJECTS

#1

#2

#3

Under each of the 3 major products I write in the 5 Big things I must do to move this project forward. These projects are high level yearly type items. This Way the are ALWAYS IN FOCUS DAILY
Every other category below "Feeds" up so they are all aligned. "Kinda" like your nested loop example.

PEOPLE

* People I need to reach out to today
*People I'm waiting on

PRIORITIES
*The main things I must complete today no matter what

ACCOUNTING

Earn
Burn
Bank
Owe

AAAAHHHHHH timer just went off Still not used to that noise. Gotta go.

Hope that helps somebody!

Originally Posted by Dien Rice

A couple months ago, I started using "nested" to-do lists - and I've found it very helpful, so I thought I would share my experience here...

For some people, this may be obvious. However, for some it could really help...!

My to-do lists used to be like what many people do... I just had a single list, like a shopping list, of what I wanted to do that day, or that week...

The problem with that, was that everything was jumbled up - from different projects. So, buying the milk was mixed in with writing articles, which was mixed in with starting new business projects, which was mixed in with washing the car...

Because I wear a lot of "hats" and do many different things (as many of us do!), it didn't give me "clarity" on what I was doing - and also wasn't very motivational. I couldn't really see the progress I was making on various things, because they were all jumbled up...

Now, I have a much better system...

My to-do list is split into different categories, and "nested"...

(I call these "nested to-do lists" as they look a little bit like "nested loops" in programming...)

For example, Here's what part of my to-do list looked like recently... (I say it looked like this recently, because I've already fixed the dripping tap now. I've written the press release, but haven't sent it out yet, so I'm still working on that project...)

• Fix dripping tap
  • Get wrench
  • Shut off outside water
  • Undo tap
  • Buy replacement washers, o-rings
  • Put everything back together
  • Turn outside water back on
• Write press release for my friend John's restaurant, about his pies (to help him out)
  • Interview John
  • Write press release in point form, first paragraph should answer 5 W's
  • Arrange in order from most important to least important
  • Finalize draft of press release
  • Format the press release the right way (with John's contact information)
  • Make list of newspapers to contact, and their phone numbers
    • The Age
    • The Herald-Sun
    • (etc.)
  • Call all the newspapers, to get the contact name to send it to, and how they'd like to receive it
  • Send the press release, the way they want to receive it (e.g. via email, etc.)
• (Many more items here...)

To help organize this, I use Workflowy - http://workflowy.com ...

I can now easily cross off the parts I have done, as I do them.

Also, as I do it, I can see at a glance exactly where I am in that "project" - whether I still have many steps to do, or whether I'm near the end.

I have another section for completed projects - so once I've done all the steps in a project, I move the whole project to that section (so it's out of the way).

This seems to work for me, whether the project would take a day, take a week, or month, or even many months... It's nice to be able to see how I'm "progressing" on each project at a glance (as I cross off each step as I do it)...

Workflowy (which is free) helps with this because you can easily add new items or new steps, cross off what you've done, you can have unlimited levels of "nesting" (I have 3 levels in the press release project above), and you can also easily move things around... You can also "collapse" the sub-lists you don't want to see (so you don't get distracted by them)...

Anyway, I thought I'd share this... Having these more "organized" to-do lists has really helped with getting things done, and I've found it much more motivational, too...

Does anyone have any techniques or methods which have helped them to get things completed they can post... Now here was one of mine. I'll rack my brains for more.

Best wishes,

Dien

[Dien Rice]

Hi Duane,

Thanks for sharing your techniques!

Originally Posted by Duane Adolph

You Asked for any "Techniques or methods that have helped to get things completed. Yes.

1. EGG TIMER

Think Eugene Schwartz put me onto this productivity tool. I set up a 20 min. timeblock to get certain groups of tasks done i.e FB, Emails. Even right now. It is going as I type this. Just the sound alone put me into an intense mode. I'm using a REAL EGG TIMER. I think somebody posted on Sowpub earlier about this tool. If you want an online version (great for if you are in a public place use http://e.ggtimer.com/)

Thanks for sharing this.

I sometimes use a timer too. I agree, it does put "pressure" on you to get things done... And I do seem to get more done when using it, too!

In case it's useful, I use "Ytimer" software - http://www.spacejock.com/yTimer.html . It's free.

The reason why I use it is that you can set several, simultaneous timers (up to 40).

Also, you can shut off your computer, then boot it up again later - and the timer still has the right time! That means you can even use the timer for longer times (e.g. for deadlines), when you might shut down your computer in the middle of the "countdown" time period...

I wouldn't mind getting an actual physical, sands-through-the-hourglass type of timer though. While it would be less flexible, there's something nice I think about actual physical mechanisms...

2. Blank coiled black notepad with just plain paper. Like in school.
The ones I like are by a company called Blueline

3. Brendon Burchard's Technique I like. Every Day I write out the following Subjects

PROJECTS

#1

#2

#3

Under each of the 3 major products I write in the 5 Big things I must do to move this project forward. These projects are high level yearly type items. This Way the are ALWAYS IN FOCUS DAILY
Every other category below "Feeds" up so they are all aligned. "Kinda" like your nested loop example.

PEOPLE

* People I need to reach out to today
*People I'm waiting on

PRIORITIES
*The main things I must complete today no matter what

ACCOUNTING

Earn
Burn
Bank
Owe

That seems like a great technique! Thanks for sharing it...

I like the "Earn, Burn, Bank, Owe"... Kind of cool...

- Dien