achieving world piece ...

goodness ...

seems to have stepped on your toes..or something.

point is that the efforts many people make to seek the peace within the world is really within themselves ?

and

your prejuidices, I would rate as choices.

and , I believe that the majority of people are asleep at the wheel ...and need the waking up that some different approach may give them.

[MMacGillivray]

... I'm afraid the survival of the strongest and elimination of the weakest in society means there's a built-in need to fight. While I would love it if there were no wars, I truly believe that this is a hope too far. Evolution is to blame.

Margaret

[Ankesh]

I'm an optimist. And think that world peace is possible.

The solution lies in the Robbers Cave Experiment.
http://www.age-of-the-sage.org/psych...xperiment.html

Please don't Attack...

But Unfortunately... Too many religions and People wanting Power is the real Problem and cause of War(s)...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War

If they would all Drop their Personal agendas...

And Work at Finding Solutions while Respecting others...

We Might just see World Peace one Day...

Hopefully!

Phil

Phil,

Thanks for hitting the nail on the head.

World Peace is not possible as long as some want to control others for their own benefit.

Segue: Lord of The Rings is a story about Power and its ability to Corrupt. Rewatch it with That in mind and you'll see the movie in a different light.

Michael Ross

Ankesh,

Thanks for linking to the Robber's Cave.

World Peace is NOT possible, nor should it be a Wish of anyone.

I'll get back to that, but first The Robber's Cave.

While the groups did Kind of Merge in the end, it required a Constant Problem to bring them together. In their case it was Real.

We have this same thing going on now. Countries, such as the USA, use a whole bunch of Imaginary Hobgoblins to Bring the country together. From non-existent HIV/AIDS and SARS to War On <s>Action</s> Terror and other Phoney stuff.

Political parties cement their Side by Blaming the other side, or those who came before. Blah blah blah.

When situations Constantly change, and over a period of time, those groups of boys Would have segmented again. And a more rigid Heirarchy would have appear. Some boys would have become Bullys.

And this is why World Peace is NOT possible. Because there are those who think it is fine and dandy to Take, Steal, Rob and Coerce members of their own country and entire other countries, for their own gains.

Your Saddams, Mugabes, Hitlers, et al, are Prime examples of this. Of living off of the efforts of others. As long as That exists, then World Peace is NOT possible. And as ALL "democratic" government works this way, then as long as there are "democratic" governments - or socialist or communist - World peace is not possible.

Why should World Peace NOT be wished for? Because it becomes a wish to control other people instead of leaving them be.

By wanting World Peace you are wanting all those who do Not want world peace, to change to suit you.

This world is the sum of its inhabitants. The mindless mind. A world Not in peace is the result.

If you want world peace, then Create your own world with Global Peace as its main principle. But don't wish to Force it onto others.

Michael Ross

[Ankesh]

The control arguement is a flawed argument. It falls back on itself. You are trying to control my thoughts and actions by telling me that I shouldn't wish for world peace because its a wish to control others who don't want world peace. You've just gone one level deeper. (Hope thats not tooo confusing...)

Control is always going to be there - as long as you have any sort of power.

There can be no vaccum where interaction takes place. When people interact - the by-product is power.

The question is: how to channel that power / control.

goodness....

getting really philosophical and all...

I was 'amused' when ol George declared that GOD told him to save the Iraqi people ...and we should go blow the place up in HIS name...hmmmm

on the other channel , Saddam was telling his folks that ALLAH had directed him to oppose the in invasion ...

both guys talking to their GODS....who control the destiny of men.
???

anyway , my original point ....and the PIECE part of it ...was the fragmentation of the world society due to everyones pursuit of HIS/HER happiness at the cost of someone else's 'happiness'...

and the fact that the 'activities' listed are very seldom achieved by ME...sure that some of yall have the fragmentation firmly together...

but that the dog has these activities as a way of life ...

unfortunately, I agree with Michael...as long as ANYone wants his or her happiness at the expense of someone else ....there will be fragmentation.

until the INDIVIDUAL person has as her mission the happiness of other people as the definition of HER happiness the splits will occur..and, having know several women with that attitude of 'service', they eventually get tired of giving and not getting back.

thanks for the thoughts

bob

Bob,

Thanks for mentioning the leaders and their "gods".

until the INDIVIDUAL person has as her mission the happiness of other people as the definition of HER happiness the splits will occur

This is the same Jibble put forth for eons. To "live for others". Obviously, this is Flawed as you yourself immediately state after the above...

having know several women with that attitude of 'service', they eventually get tired of giving and not getting back

If Happiness was achieved by Serving Others, then these woman would have been Happy.

THINK for a moment WHO is telling you to achieve happiness by serving others? The Church? Hmmm.... think they have something to gain.

ANY time someone tells you to Serve Others there is a Slave/Master thing at play somewhere. If you look you will find it.

Happiness - however that is defined - would be Better Achieved by... pleasing yourself without infringing upon other people's property rights while Not expecting Something For Nothing. An Equal Exchange of Values, in other words.

What happens instead is, people try to get values for nothing from other people. To Control them for their own benefit. To withhold information the other person would need to make an Informed Decision.

Children see this in action from their parents, teachers, politicians and so on. And simply Adopt what they see without question.

We touched on this Briefly on the other forum. Conflict can be resolved by two people Unless...

1. There is a Thirdy Party involved

2. One is trying to get values for nothing from the other person (Control them for their own gain).

Michael Ross

Ankesh,

Thanks for being thinking.

Actually, it's Not a flawed arguement.

World Peace is achieved Only by Not wanting Power over others - something unlikely to happen on this planet. I am merely Stating and pointing out to you, the very idea of wanting world peace is to want power over others - to control them for your wishes, and to Assume everyone else wants the same as you. And this is to be guilty of the same thing the more-visible "world Not at peace" people are guilty of.

Me? I have no such desire. I do not wish to change the world. I am quite okay with Letting it and its inhabitants be how they want to be. I merely point out the hypocrisy of wanting world peace.

POWER: Power can not be taken it can only be Given. If someone has POwer over you it is because YOU give them that power.

If I do not give my power willingly, the only recourse a power monger has is to turn it into something physical. But Physical power only has a limited effect and can backfire doubly so.

Michael Ross