How To Eradicate Poverty

[Ankesh]

Millions of people didn't GET poor. They were BORN poor.

How would you go about teaching them to become productive?

Originally Posted by Ankesh

Millions of people didn't GET poor. They were BORN poor.

How would you go about teaching them to become productive?

Great question Ankesh!

I'm not sure what the best way to do that would be but I recall reading in the book "INFLUENCER - The Power To Change Anything"
about someone in India who started to give out micro loans to poor people so they could start businesses.

And the success rate of those he helps is very high!

Some people just need a hand up - not a hand out.

Cheers,
Steve Shulenski

[Ankesh]

Thanks Steve.

That someone is Muhammad Yunus. He is from Bangladesh. He started the Grameen Bank. Which has been modeled by a lot of other countries now.

And the bank had 98% rate of loan payback because Muhammad gave out loans only when people who wanted money grouped together.

The groups added to peer pressure - the groups made sure that each member paid their loans on time. And each person worked hard. The group also worked as a mastermind - helping a member with difficulties.

So it wasn't just micro-financing. It was micro-financing + groups that did that trick.

Ankesh,

I was going to mention micro-financing!

I think that is a great way to give a hand up and not a hand out.

I am wanting to invest in micro-financing.

A question for everyone. Which organization should be invested in? Which is on the level with the money going to help the people and mot the administration? Which helps the most people? Where would my money do the most good?

OK. It was more than one question but you get my drift.

Thanks,
Ken

[Ankesh]

http://www.kiva.org is a good bet. (No personal experience though - but have heard good things.)

Thanks, I have heard of them. I was looking at World Vision. Do you know anything about them?

Ken

Originally Posted by Ankesh

Millions of people didn't GET poor. They were BORN poor.

Yes, I understand that -- I was just pointing out there;s a difference between those two.

There's a further distinction among people who were born poor -- do they live in a society in which people move up (+ down) the socio-economic ladder?

America is one of those places, imo. Therefore, being born poor here may or may not qualify one for help. In other words, even if you're born poor in America, it's much easier to help yourself OUT of poverty here than in other places. Therefore, you'd have to prove MORE hardship here to get a hand-up or a hand-out.

The basic question is, is the poverty coming from withIN or from withOUT.

For lack of a better word, whose FAULT is it?

If it's the person's fault, then they should dig themselves out. If it's society's fault, then society should help out.

But 'fault' is not easy to determine!

Analogy: trying to figure out whose 'fault' a heart attack is. Is it right to start charging a 'fat tax' on food that isn't heart healthy? Is it right to blame the person who eats fatty foods for a heart attack? How can you be SURE that's what caused it? People who eat healthy + jog 10 miles/day ALSO get heart attacks.

-- TW

[Ankesh]

Ok let me try rephrasing things a bit.

A video I once watched had a quote that has stuck with me. To paraphrase, it went: The Sun gives light and warmth to everyone. It doesn't see who is poor or who is rich.

Can we use technology to raise food / water / clothing / shelter to the level of sunlight?

(Actually - water is mostly free in most developed nations already... can we do the same thing for basic food too? And then for clothing and shelter?)

Maslow's hierarchy of needs pyramid has 5 levels. Can we take care of the bottom level for everyone - no matter if he is good or bad - or smart or dumb?

(For Michael - should we? If not - why not?)

* I'm not talking communism over here. I'm not talking equal benefits for everyone. I'm not saying people can't buy Evian water if they want to. I'm just saying - can we make tap water free for everyone in the world? And can we make other basic survival amenities free for everyone? Rich folks can buy upgrades - no restrictions on that.

Umm -- unlike sunlight, the money has to come from somewhere.

You're tying to apply the (impossible) napster model to the necessities in life.

What killed napster? -- "The money has to come from somewhere."

Why can't communism work? "The money has to come from somewhere."

I know you say you're not talking about communism -- but really you are, because, it seems you're forgetting, "The money has to come from somewhere."

It's not a zero-sum game, that's true. An economy can EXPAND. But only through more productivity + more transactions.

Money cannot come from 'nothing' or 'nowhere' -- the way sunlight does.

Even producing water takes money, and... "The money has to come from somewhere."

-- TW

[Ankesh]

Ok -- so where can the money / resources come from?

TW - asking how to get it done - even though it brings in unrealistic answers - is better then saying it can't be done. At least for the sake of this conversation. Brainstorming comes before playing devils advocate.

Mark Joyner explains it better than I can:
http://www.markjoyner.name/logs/mj_constructs1.php
(I know some folks don't like Joyner - but I personally think he is very smart.)

Ok - lets talk technology:

Japan actually provides free internet to its people. And Japan is certainly not a communist country. Why do the Japanese provide free internet? Because free internet = higher productivity and more money in circulation. And the cost of providing free internet is miniscule.

1. Water: Its almost free in most developed nations. And low cost gadgets are available that can convert water vapour into water - which can be used in developing nations.

2. Electricity: I believe the price of electricity will be next to negligible within the next 20-30 years. Solar power will become very cheap.

Any ideas for food / clothing / shelter?

How much do geodesic homes cost these days? I remember reading something about a company creating houses that cost very little and can be installed within a day or so... but forgot the name...