TW (and others) Very good discussin. IMHO

TW,

Thanks for adding some more.

I wrote: When hinting that ALL/ANY business is actually a if-you-need-it-you-need-it-if-you-don't-you-don't type of business when that just isn't the case.

You wrote: I didn't say that. I said the opposite. I said most biz's are not if-you-need-it-you-need-it-if-you-don't-you-don't types of biz's. I said many THINK they are, when they are not.

See. Now I am confused. I said businesses are Not that type. Then you said that wasn't what you said but that businesses are not that type. So as I see it, we do actually have an accord on this.

You wrote: doesn't that mean my push *caused* your 'pull' reaction?

No. As we were Actively Looking and had even started researching the possibility of having a fixed ladder Made for just the purpose we needed, it was just a matter of time before we came across it via our many phone calls - or - acquired what we needed by another method (having it made).

We were also looking into the possibility of having a small cherry picker system mounted onto the back of a pickup. Thinking this would have wider ranging benefits. And when not in use by us could be hired out to others who also needed such a thing.

I don't recall how we eventually found that ladder. But I know it was NOT by any Mainstream Method. THEY didn't Cause anything in us.

For all I know I saw the ladder outside a store in its bent position - I'm talking 20 years ago now. So some of the details - like where I initially found this thing, which is now readily available in all hardware stores - are a little vague. But if it was outside a store, they did nothing to cause my need for the ladder. They did nothing to cause me to stop and enter the store.

All the searching was generated by Me. The moment I have no need for such a thing, all the Pushing in the world will not see my buy.

As I've said in previous threads... you could Give me a Fifty Cent CD and I'd trash it or give it to some charity store to sell. The music companies can run ads every 20 minutes for months on end. All the people I know could tell me how great it is. *I* wouldn't buy it, or even listen to it and would trash it or give it away if a copy fell into my lap.

On the other hand, I see kids newly discover Led Zeppelin and then Hunt Down all their stuff. Actively Look For albums and remastered CDs and even DVDs and hard to find audio of anything and everything they do. Acquiring some stuff legally and others via duped tapes of live performances of them before they were famous. Yet, there is no advertising done to bring this about. It is all generated By The Person.

Yes, a LOT of people do rush out and buy the moment they see ads on the TV. And it's something that's puzzled me because I've never done it or felt the urge to do it, yet have witnessed it in other people. Even from ads that were pathetic from a direct response point of view.

But a Lot of people isn't Everyone. and so, when you say in your Document, that it started with the MarktER, I see how this could be thought to be correct but also see how it is not correct. And to say... yeah but even a label in a product on a shelf is a form of PUSH, or even the dlipidated old sign out front is a sign of PUSH, is not getting into semantics. And it negates the self-created desire for a solution to a problem of the buyer that would see them find what they were after at some point in time anyway - even if that way ends up being word of mouth.

Michael Ross