The Game & Lifestyle Epiphany

[GordonJ]

Originally Posted by -TW

It's the type of thinking that I'm sure causes Gary Halbert to roll over in his grave.

-- TW

I see you are a HUGE Gary Halbert fan. I LOVED Gary. HOWEVER, regarding business...he wasn't very good at it. By his own admission. He was great at creating excitement...

but, he died a pauper...his estate unable (or unwilling) to refund the $15,000.00 in cash that people gave to him for work he never got around to doing. It wasn't that he got the money the day before he died, he held onto their money for months without delivering the goods.

I don't think anyone compares to Gary as a person able to capture people's attention and their imagination...but he really didn't offer up much in the way of "permanent" business advice. It wasn't his cup of tea.

So, as for Gary turning over in his grave...I doubt it. He didn't care all that much when he was alive. He knew how to make a buck, often quickly. He didn't know how to keep them, or how to build a business.

But TW, I see this "discussion" has you with a very clear and distinct point of view...you don't believe in "magnetic marketing" in any way, shape or form...is that about right?

gja

GH was a terrible biz person. The only reason he even survived was his instictual knowledge that active mrktng is the way to go.

I DO believe there is such a thing as magnetic marketing -- or, more accurately, there IS an advantage to becoming a 'magnet.'

For instance, having a website is usually a GREAT idea -- and vital to one's success.

What I object to is, people not putting 'being a magnet' into proper perspective. Often, on the list of things to do, it should be placed at the bottom of the list, not the top.

It produces the least amount of biz, not the most. Yes, it produces the EASIEST amount of biz -- the amount that requires the LEAST amount of work, yes.

One could even say it produces the BEST customers. But it almost never produces the MOST customers.

If you are looking to create a marketing MACHINE (which I see as the ultimate goal), then being a magnet -- or trying to -- is a losing proposition.

THAT'S the perspective from which I am jumping up + down ;-)

I just see so many people getting that wrong -- because it's so SEDUCTIVE to follow those who would have you believe in the 'magnet' myth.

It allows one to *abdicate* one's own (true) marketing 'responsibility' -- and smile blindly/ignorantly while doing so.

Cheers!

-- TW

Aloha TW,

Originally Posted by -TW

If you are looking to create a marketing MACHINE (which I see as the ultimate goal), then being a magnet -- or trying to -- is a losing proposition.

I am curious to hear...

1) Your specific idea of a "marketing machine".
2) Why magnetic marketing is detrimental to that.

Aloha,

Jason Cain

Marketing machine: A 'device' in which you shovel potential customers in the top, and customers come out the bottom. Has a gas pedal too. The harder you push the gas pedal, them more customers come out the bottom. A real mrktng machine has this attribute: The gas pedal is under the marketER's control, not the marketEE's control.

I never said so-called 'magnetic' marketing is detrimental to a mrktng machine. On the contrary, it is most often ESSENTIAL to a well-funtioning machine. All I object to is, calling it 'magnetic.' That name is misleading. There's nothing 'magnetic' about it. That's all.

I use strategies like that all the time! I would be lost without them! I just don't call them magnetic. They are not.

Actually, some would say, being 'a magnet,' which I think is the wrong way to go (or to strive for, anyway), DOES NOT include using those so-called 'magnetic mrktng' methods exactly BECAUSE those methods are NOT truly magnetic. They DO involve ACTIVELY contacting the prospect REPEATEDLY -- which is a method that I DO advocate.

So, in summary: I DO advocate what is commonly called 'magnetic' markeitng (a la D. Kennedy), because it IS effective (but not really magnetic). And I DON'T advocate trying to 'be a magnet,' 'build it and they wil come,' etc.

Defining your universe (gather a list of potential customers), then bugging them repeatedly (you reaching them, not the other way 'round) IS the way to build an effective marketing 'machine.' No matter what Seth Godin says.

Make sense?

-- TW

Being a 'magnet' (or trying to become one) isn't 'detrimental' to building a mrktng machine! It can only help!

The question is, how MUCH can it really help? THAT'S the question one has to ask oneself BEFORE spending a lot of time + money + energy making becoming a 'magnet' as a goal. THAT'S what I would caution against -- thinking it's gonna solve more problems than it really will.

Cheers!

-- TW

Aloha TW,

Being a student of Dan Kennedy for many years, I don't see any difference between your thoughts and what Dan Kennedy espouses. It seems to me that we are (I am ) getting hung up on semantics.

I do agree with everything that you have said -- and I think Dan would too.

Aloha,

Jason

What Kennedy says to do is right on -- it's just not 'magnetic,' and shouldn't be called 'magnetic.' That term is misleading.

Conversely what SHOULD be called magnetic (and is 'magnetic') is NOT the way to go, imo.

So, Kennedy, yes. Magnetic, no.

-- TW

Originally Posted by GordonJ

I see you are a HUGE Gary Halbert fan. I LOVED Gary. HOWEVER, regarding business...he wasn't very good at it. By his own admission. He was great at creating excitement...

but, he died a pauper...his estate unable (or unwilling) to refund the $15,000.00 in cash that people gave to him for work he never got around to doing. It wasn't that he got the money the day before he died, he held onto their money for months without delivering the goods.

I don't think anyone compares to Gary as a person able to capture people's attention and their imagination...but he really didn't offer up much in the way of "permanent" business advice. It wasn't his cup of tea.

So, as for Gary turning over in his grave...I doubt it. He didn't care all that much when he was alive. He knew how to make a buck, often quickly. He didn't know how to keep them, or how to build a business.

But TW, I see this "discussion" has you with a very clear and distinct point of view...you don't believe in "magnetic marketing" in any way, shape or form...is that about right?

gja

I can vouch for losing 15k from Gary Halbert last December. I was so awestruck that he would even take me on. Then he told me to get involved with a friend of his who suppposedly tested a direct mail promotion. All the guy needed was money to roll out.

The only reason I did this was because I had read previous Halbert newsletters talking about success stories of people who formed partnerships and made some money. Also the Great Halbert asked me so how could I refuse.

I don't even want to tell you what I lost on that one.

I consider myself a smart business person but once again I fell in love with the aura of Gary Halbert. Quite honestly I am ashamed and embarrassed to admit this but I'm sick and tired of people talking about Halbert as if he was a saint.

I was vulnerable at the time and he took advantage of me. Yes Gordon his estate had nothing. I talked to the attorney in charge and he sympathetically said you and a bunch of others are in the same boat and there's no money.

What have I learned. To study, read, test.....ON MY OWN!! For all of you out there be careful of all the Gurus. Due your due diligence, check everything out, don't assume anything. I went through the school of hard knocks and I don't wish that kind of "education" on anyone.

I think this is the best forum. There are a lot of great people but I'd like to single out Gordon - for he has helped me the most.